In the office of Subrahmanyam Jaishankar there are three pictures, as found in many offices of India, on the left the president, on the right the prime minister and above them the most famous Indian of all: freedom fighter Mahatma Gandhi.
The 64-year-old is one of India's most experienced diplomats. He was ambassador to Washington, Beijing, Prague and High Commissioner in Singapore. In May, Hindu nationalist Prime Minister Narendra Modi took him into his cabinet as Foreign Minister.
SPIEGEL: Mr. Jaishankar, your government seized autonomy from Jammu and Kashmir just over three months ago, arrested hundreds of people and cut off the population from the outside world for weeks. Is India still committed to Gandhi's values?
Jaishankar: You and I seem to have a very different view of what Kashmir is all about: 40,000 people have lost their lives there through terror and violence over the past 30 years. If we had not done anything, the next 30 years would have been just as bad. None of us can want that. Even Gandhi would not have wanted that.
SPIEGEL: How do you want to improve the situation in Kashmir?
Jaishankar: Kashmir autonomy served only a small elite at the end. It prevented many of India's advanced laws from coming into force in the region. Investments did not materialize. There were too few jobs created. The lack of progress led to alienation and separatism, which in turn fed terrorism. Also keep in mind that there are interest groups that want to fight us.
SPIEGEL: You mean Pakistan?
Jaishankar: Especially Pakistan, but also people in Kashmir who support Pakistan and pursue their own lower interests.
SPIEGEL: India has placed under house arrest politicians such as the former head of government of Kashmir, Mehbooba Mufti. Why?
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Jaishankar: We do not want politicians to engage in activities that could become the target of violence, as was the case in the past. Social media was used to radicalize citizens. We want to prevent the loss of life.
SPIEGEL: You cut your own telephone lines. People could not communicate with each other for a long time.
Jaishankar: Terrorists also communicated over the fixed network.
SPIEGEL: How should people have called an ambulance?
Jaishankar: And I ask you: how else could terrorists have been stopped?
SPIEGEL: In the fight against terrorism, all measures are justified?
Jaishankar: What's that question? Terrorists killed fruit dealers, shells were thrown on markets, people died. Why do not you care?
SPIEGEL: You feel unfairly treated by the Western press?
Jaishankar: There are people with predetermined views. Kashmir's autonomy, for example, was based on a temporary injunction. In Western news, this aspect was almost completely ignored. And why? Because that's an uncomfortable fact!
SPIEGEL: Pakistan and China also control a part of Kashmir. Is it hypocritical if the West criticizes India but not Pakistan or China?
Jaishankar: I think the world has a realistic view of Pakistan. The country obviously runs a terror industry.
SPIEGEL: What Islamabad denies.
Jaishankar: Really? Premier Imran Khan speaks openly about it. He admits he has a terror problem.
SPIEGEL: Beijing leave you unmentioned. Chinese companies pursue infrastructure projects in Pakistan, Nepal, Sri Lanka. What is India doing to counter China's influence in the region?
Jaishankar: Whatever we do, we do not do anything to counteract China's influence. We would invest in Nepal, Bangladesh or Sri Lanka as well, even if China did not exist. South Asia lacks regional awareness. I blame ourselves for that, after all, India is the largest country in the region. For the past five years we have been trying to correct the mistake. The better networked South Asia is, the better it is for my country.
SPIEGEL: Nevertheless, China will build the new Trans-Himalayan Railroad, which will run close to the Indian border. That must disturb you.
Jaishankar: There are already two rail links between India and Nepal, and in a few years there will be five. Nepal's border to India is open, not really to China. Many Nepalese come to India looking for work. How do you want to compare that?
SPIEGEL: Many in the West see India as a counterweight to China's influence in Asia. Where does India see itself?
Jaishankar: I find the idea that I am a puppet in some "Great Game" terribly patronizing. I do not intend to play the counterweight for third parties. I'm involved because I pursue my own ambitions.
SPIEGEL: Which are these?
Jaishankar: We will most likely be the most populous country in the world over the next five years and the third largest economy within a decade. We have a large portion of global human capital, and if I look at what digitization will play in the future, then I'm sure India can do more. It's not just about more meaning. We are aware that our weight in the world also increases our responsibility.
SPIEGEL: What does that mean?
Jaishankar: I'll give you two examples. First, Africa and the southern hemisphere play a huge emotional role for us. For someone whose home has never been colonized, this book is difficult to understand. For example, we run a development program in Africa worth more than $ 10 billion. Second, 15 years ago, a tsunami in Indonesia caused devastation. The West sent help at that time. Today the world is different. Today we jump in. Whether after the severe earthquake in Nepal or the civil war in Yemen, the Indian army helped every time.
SPIEGEL: Do you also count the fight against climate change? India is now the world's third largest producer of greenhouse gases.
Jaishankar: We have one of the most ambitious programs for solar energy. We help other developing countries achieve their goals. According to the research consortium Climate Action Tracker, there are just five states whose energy policies can be reconciled with the two-degree goal of the Paris Agreement: Bhutan, Costa Rica, Ethiopia, the Philippines - and India. We are better off than Europe.
SPIEGEL: However, the researchers also point out that India's emissions rose by 4.8 percent last year. When will India stop building new coal-fired power plants?
Jaishankar: You are saying that very absolutely. My answer depends on many factors, such as how fast India can expand alternative energies such as solar, water or even nuclear power. It is clear that coal is not our first choice. It's just that it's easy for someone from Germany to ask that question, because Germany has so many alternatives. We do not have it.
SPIEGEL: You demand that we are more realistic?
Jaishankar: Or more generous. Or more reliable when it comes to keeping promises.
SPIEGEL: US President Donald Trump stands for a new era of nationalism and protectionism. India, too, has become more nationalist.
Jaishankar: That's true, but nationalism is not equal to nationalism. Nationalism in Europe is born out of fear that privileges may not endure. Our nationalism is positively posed and goes back to the independence movement. We also do not turn away from the world. We turn to her.
SPIEGEL: Does India share the concern of Europeans that Trump could damage international institutions?
Jaishankar: Let me explain the difference between Germany and India: You are an ally of the USA. We are not. We are used to dealing with American governments that were not always well-disposed to us in the past. We are confronting America as well as other states, with a high degree of realism. President Trump is President Trump. We Indians are pragmatic.