Armin Laschet, the Prime Minister of North Rhine-Westphalia, speaks in an interview with Munich's Merkur about how politics deals with the Corona crisis.
- Armin Laschet, the Prime Minister of North Rhine-Westphalia, speaks in an interview about how politics deals with the corona crisis *.
- Laschet calls for a "return to responsible normality" in the Corona crisis.
- Here you will find the basic facts about the corona virus *. You can also see the current number of cases in Germany as a map *. The most important thing about the topic is also on our brand new Facebook page Corona News.
Munich / Düsseldorf - Armin Laschet was well on the way to becoming CDU leader, candidate for chancellor and probably chancellor. The Corona crisis, which hit his home country almost as badly as Bavaria, is shaking up all plans. As Prime Minister of North Rhine-Westphalia , Laschet has to make the most difficult decisions of his term in the virus fight. As a CDU politician, he is at the same time nationwide at the top of the heads of government who are promoting loosening. What's next? We arranged to have a detailed interview with Laschet, by far by phone.
Mr. Laschet, this year we will probably all have to go on vacation at home. Where can we find you during the summer vacation?
I don't know if there is enough time for holidays this year. A few days at Lake Constance with the family would be nice.
Your Union friends Söder and Merkel have already given domestic travel tips in public. South, said Söder. North, said Merkel. Only the West, your NRW, would be out of the game then, Söder teased.
The situation of the tourism industry is pretty serious. We are happy about everyone who goes on vacation in the Sauerland, in the Münsterland, in the Eifel, on the Rhine or in the Siebengebirge. Everyone just advertises their own country - and I haven't known that Bavaria is beautiful until I graduated from Munich.
Seriously: Are you annoyed by all these little pinpricks from Munich?
No. When Markus and I talk, we often stumble.
Corona policy: is the background of the Union's chancellor issue?
We make a different observation: just as Söder was rushing when shutting down the country, you are now rushing forward with the easing. It's also about the chancellor issue in the Union in the background!
Clear no. It is true that I warned early on about weighing up the damage, including that caused by the massive interference with fundamental rights - social, health and economic damage. But the openings that we are now talking about are basically parallel in all countries despite all the different concerns. I've always promoted that. What is particularly important to me: we have to keep in mind that we can also cause immense damage through the lockdown. That's what many doctors, social organizations, the child protection association, business and trade unions tell us.
By opening too quickly.
Naturally. We therefore have to be careful, groping, weighing up again and again. I call that a return to responsible normality. There is also health damage if we do not open it. We have children who have not been to daycare, school or the pediatrician for weeks - undesirable developments in some families are now invisible. We have cases of depression, loneliness, suicides. Rehabilitation clinics are closed. Bavarian doctors recently warned that heart attacks would be delayed because those affected avoided the clinics for fear of corona infections. That must not be.
Crisis round with the Chancellor: Armin Laschet between Angela Merkel and Markus Söder. Back: Federal Health Minister Jens Spahn
© Bernd von Jutrczenka / dpa
Söder prefers "Bavarian caution rather than stumbled over". Do you feel addressed?
No. We are very careful. The key question is: Do we close all public life for a long time? Or do we get used to - as Austria's Chancellor Sebastian Kurz aptly said - take responsibility and protect ourselves in a more targeted manner, for example with hygiene and distance rules and tracing infection chains, soon with an app? The numbers currently give us the space for more personal responsibility. Caution is always right, and regions in Bavaria are certainly currently affected differently than North Rhine-Westphalia, for example, where the success of our measures has been visible earlier. But I am optimistic that the situation in Bavaria will continue to improve and that a perspective on a new normal will be opened up.
Corona crisis: "There is reason to hope"
Looking back: Was it right not to cancel the carnival in NRW? And the strong beer festival in Bavaria?
We all learn about it. I don't want to comment on the conduct of the strong beer festivals in Bavaria in March. I assume that the authorities have carefully considered their decisions here. The following must be known about the carnival that ended in February: The first corona case occurred on Tuesday after the carnival in Heinsberg. We then took all the necessary measures quickly, such as closing the schools and daycare centers in the district overnight. The fact that we act consistently right from the start and that we are successful in the fight against the pandemic is also confirmed in the facts. North Rhine-Westphalia had an R-value according to the Helmholtz model of 0.448 this weekend, when the nationwide R-value was 0.76 - the second best value in Germany. No reason to give the all-clear, that can change again. But there is hope.
You messed with the virologists. They said that the corona crisis was too serious to be left only to the virologists and their changing recommendations ...
That's not how I put it. It is true that politicians in this situation rely on the knowledge of experts. Virologists and epidemiologists are currently of outstanding importance and their scientific contribution is of great value. At the same time, it is difficult if politicians absolutely set the assessment of virologists and then virological recommendations change frequently: close schools or not, wear masks or not. In this crisis, we have to make holistic, science-based decisions. For this we also need ethicists, sociologists, lawyers, economists who can contribute their knowledge. In the end, politics always has to decide.
Efforts of the past few weeks with careful opening to responsible normality have paid off: #NRW has today, according to the # helmholtz-Zentrum Braunschweig with 0.43 the lowest R-factor of the 16 German countries. Now more personal responsibility instead of bans is required https://t.co/zFW3QaGqMI
- Armin Laschet (@ArminLaschet) May 3, 2020There is a lot of misunderstanding about how the long standstill is justified. First it was the doubling numbers, then the R-value, now the general principle of caution. There is a lack of transparency!
There has been political disagreement as to whether it is right to talk about standards. I think so. We need criteria. They have to be so clear for every citizen that they can see: Aha, if this and that goal are achieved, public life is possible again. The more transparent we are, the more people stick to the rules. That's how it is in a liberal democracy.
The Chancellor has not followed you in this line of argument to this day.
She also recently emphasized how important the interdisciplinary approach is. Besides, it doesn't matter. We can set different accents between the federal government and the federal states on factual issues. Everyone knows how much I appreciate the Chancellor.
Corona crisis: Laschet wants a step-by-step plan for daycare centers and primary schools
On May 6, the Prime Ministers meet again with the Chancellor to decide on daycare centers and primary schools. What will you fight for?
It is time that we give prospects again for employees, but especially for families and children. Children and parents in particular are suffering to a great extent at the moment. We need clear step-by-step plans for day-care centers and schools, but also mass sports. All of this, of course, with the nationwide standards for protection concepts.
And how should the restaurants continue?
A difficult question. As soon as alcohol is involved, the distance requirement is often forgotten. But even if we don't open restaurants immediately, businesses and their many employees now need a perspective. Gastronomy is an important part of our culture. Here, too, we need at least common step-by-step plans that give the entire industry a temporal orientation.
Also read: Coronavirus: Maas demands transparency from China about pandemic origin
How long does it make sense to keep the external borders closed?
It hurts my heart as a European when I see the blocked Europe bridge between Kehl and Strasbourg. We should get to the opening of the French border quickly, soon after the curfews in France end on May 11th. The economic reconstruction of Europe can only succeed with open internal borders. I fought very hard to keep our national border with Belgium and the Netherlands open, which fortunately never closed. Our problem was not foreigners entering the country, but the German returnees from their skiing holiday who brought the virus with them.
Corona crisis: "We have to keep in mind that the lockdown also causes immense damage"
And in the south - the border with Austria?
I'm not talking to my colleagues in the south.
For a long time they were considered the Chancellor's favorite. But now Merkel is praised by her intimate enemy Merz for her corona management. Are you worried about the support of the Merkel camp in the election of the chairman?
I am not concerned with this question at the moment, and citizens are currently having other concerns than the question of the CDU chairmanship. I work practically around the clock to make the most of the country, for which I am responsible as Prime Minister, the Corona crisis.
If there is no hurry anyway: Would it be okay if AKK simply remains the CDU leader?
She does her job with all responsibility, that is appreciated in the party. We'll discuss everything else at a different time.
Söder goes far in all polls for the best candidate for Union chancellor. Do the popularity ratings have to play a role in the selection?
Again: We are not currently dealing with this. The CDU has exceptionally good values in North Rhine-Westphalia - where it was in opposition for 50 years - with 40 percent and is above the nationwide CDU average. According to all surveys, people are satisfied with the state government. I am also pleased that the CSU is back strong at 50 percent and the Prime Minister is popular. Markus Söder does everything for Bavaria, that is highly valued, including me. If the Union is strong in Bavaria and North Rhine-Westphalia, it will do all of Germany good.
Interview: Georg Anastasiadis and Christian Deutschländer
Also read: Does Corona knock everything over? Seehofer praises Merkel - and gives an insight into far-reaching internal debates - and Corona was also the subject of “Anne Will” on Sunday evening. Markus Söder met with strong opposition in the group.
* Merkur.de is part of the nationwide Ippen-Digital editors network.