"I will work hard to overthrow the government" • "Bibi refers to religious Zionism in patronage" • "For years there is a deal between the prime minister and the justice system, for his survival" • "Rabbi Peretz buried a hundred-year party" • "I intend to build with Bennett Big Party "• Bezalel Smutrich, in a belligerent interview:" I'll be back "

• Bezalel Smutrich // Photo: Oren Cohen

22 minutes passed from the time I turned on the tape recorder to the first time I was able to answer a question. Bezalel Smutrich has unraveled the past two events without stunts and stuttering. He is always effervescent, eloquent, sharp and uncompromising, but this time Smutrich is on fire.

"What Netanyahu did is not to humiliate me, is to humiliate the values ​​I represent, to try to silence a public I represent. I have hundreds of Likudanics who say they will never vote for Likud again because of what happened. Likudnik appreciates a partner who wants to work and knows how to work. I lost, I could now walk around like a puffy peacock, with a bureau and a driver, but that doesn't interest me, I'm a fan of the worldview of religious Zionism.

"I am completely in agreement with our decision to go to the opposition. It is a right decision. We could not afford to enter into a coalition with Netanyahu's humiliating and disgraceful attitude. I heard him say he did not slam a door on our joining. Only he never opened it. There was no freight meeting. And one, not even one.

"There were conversations in the zoom. We didn't even sit in one room. I know what negotiation talks look like, we were in two such rounds. Sitting in the room, arguing, discussing, coming out thinking, coming back, discussing again, consulting, exchanging drafts. Sit with us in one room. I know what Netanyahu looks like when he wants something. He strives for contact, locks you in Balfour for ten hours and doesn't let you out. He brings negotiating teams around a table. See what they did with the ultra-Orthodox. Deri and Litzman argued, and Netanyahu appeased them.

"With us he was content with two zoom calls. We heard about his suggestions on Twitter, half an hour before Saturday. Politics is a circle square art, not a circle you can't quadruple. You can always find a way to get out of it. But for that you have to sit down and talk.

"When there is a partnership, when the two partners want to continue together, it is important for them that the other partner feels good. Even when there are conflicts of interest and arguments and when one does not always see eye to eye. We felt that Netanyahu did not want to put us in the coalition, so he said: 'Want - take, don't want - run away' He gave humiliating suggestions, the attitude was humiliating.

"He issued a message saying, 'I offered them everything that is important to religious Zionism', in a kind of patronage, like he said, 'I put you in your corner, say thank you and deal with it.' He decided what was important to religious Zionism, and now I say, 'Don't touch on the issues. What about you and the health bag? What are you and the transportation bag? As if when the ultra-Orthodox held the health file, it had to do with them. As if the interior bag was only about Deri's public. And we, religious Zionism, should stay in our little corner and we should not play in the national court. Getting into such a situation is a disaster.

"Netanyahu has decided that his partnership with Deri is a strategic partnership, and that he wants it to continue, so he made sure Deri was satisfied. He now gave him everything Deri wanted, and he would make sure he was satisfied later down the road. For example, when the budget discussions came. We would come to him, he would say 'no money'.

"I believe he would not coordinate with us the maps of sovereignty, the fact that sovereignty might include recognition of a Palestinian state. I suppose he would not share us with any real process. If he does not want you as a partner, you do not care.

"Anyone who wants to understand Netanyahu's attitude to religious Zionism can look at what happened to Rabbi Rafi Peretz. He crept it under the table and didn't even give him the important things about religious Zionism, such as the National Service, the Nuclear Nuclei, the Settlement Division. For a few months she was going to London or France, and then he would not pass it on to Rabbi Rafi, but rather to Tsahi Hanegbi, who voted for the deportation and then was in the Kadima party. "

You give yourself the answer. Maybe Netanyahu doesn't need you because he has religious Zionism within the Likud - people such as Edelstein, Elkin, Houtubly.

"And look what he did to them. He ousted Edelstein from the Knesset Speaker, stuck a knife in his back. Elkin was ousted from his position at the Ministry of Environmental Protection, though Elkin wanted to stay and said it above every possible stage. He built him a portfolio for nothing and nothing. I wish him success, the question is if there is a stage to succeed. And to Hotbelly, he let her sing about anything and everything, and that too, temporarily, until he sent her abroad.

"This is not a person who wants a partnership, it's a person who deals with patronage of religious Zionism. "Its current as it is now, which is also very sectoral and deals with its needs, but also very national and deals with everything about the Land of Israel and in every area of ​​the State of Israel with a national right-wing view, and without compromise."

***

In the elections, you received only six seats. Maybe that means no sectoral party is needed anymore?

"To me this is completely wrong. I believe in the importance of preserving the affiliation of religious Zionism. If left unchecked, it will cease to affect. The power of religious Zionism, its influence, is because it is a public, a vibrant, vibrant, kicking movement. The public is a political force, Cultural, economic, this is an ability to act, but it is true that the influence of religious Zionism is beyond the relative power of the population because it is a cohesive public, if we become a lot of private religious Zionist people, we will lose the power.

"This is the least sectoral, all idealistic. When I care for the needs of this public, I care for the needs of the entire Israeli public. When I budget the settlement it is not because my friends are there; on the contrary, my friends are there because it is a continuation of the Zionist mission. Concerned about the budget of religious Zionist institutions, I build the greenhouses in which the next generation of soldiers of the State of Israel are built.

"At the same time, we certainly want a hand at the helm on national questions. We have something to say in health, education, transport and a lot of national things. Religious Zionism has had a century in the national field, compared to the ultra-Orthodox public, who has come up with far less say in this regard.

"The ultra-Orthodox community is going through beautiful processes because it grows and takes responsibility and must be universal-Israeli, but the ultra-Orthodox movement has nothing to say about the State of Israel, it does not see it as worthwhile at all. Religious Zionism as a movement has national pretensions, and when it meets Netanyahu's desire to be a single player on the field, a one-man show - it clashes.

"Netanyahu can't accept the fact that we challenge him in the Cabinet, challenge him in Corona, challenge him in other matters. He is trying to present our position as illegitimate and illegitimate, as if we were against him. Why ?! Coalition is not Gulliver and 61 Dwarfs, this coalition is a partnership We have something to say, and it is our duty, as someone sent by a public with a statement and agenda, but once a decision is made, we know how to stand behind it. You are the prime minister, we respect and appreciate and ultimately make your decisions.

"I, for example, took responsibility for closing Sde Dov during my first week in office, even though I thought it was folly. After all, I struggled against it for three years in the Knesset.

Were there other cases where you did things contrary to your position?

"In the 20th Knesset, I swallowed frogs. What are frogs? For example! I thought I should not hold the verdict on Amona evacuation. But I stabilized and defended the government, saying it did everything it could, struggling, to build the established Amichai settlement that followed. The evacuation.

"I thought the ruling that was given was a product of misconduct in the state's response to the High Court many years ago, and so we said now that we were not prepared for it to be repeated. The Ministry of Defense and the Ministry of Justice, which are relevant to state answers on all settlement issues, are in the left? So we need to be on the relevant ministerial committee, to be on hand with the Shalter.

"Another example: did you sell the Bedouin in the Negev for Amir Peretz's crate commanders? So I require the National Enforcement Supervision Unit, to be around the table, so that I can say that I can stop some of the horrible processes that could be lawless and eliminate the Zionist vision of the Negev. "You need to get the Justice Department's break in the Knesset - a constitutional committee. I cannot enter a government where I take part in a lot of problematic things, without having the slightest influence on these processes and without significant ability to do so."

Likud states that you have received a proposal for the significant education portfolio, and another small portfolio and issues that are important to you, such as the National Service, the Settlement Division.

"Netanyahu wanted to give us the education file, which in the end turned out to be disassembled, and another case for nothing and nothing, like the five or six cases he has built over the past few days to please some people. We're not ready to be part of this game. Understand the complexity, swallow frogs, but give the ability to make an impact, that we will not stand and see the train galloping into the abyss, and we need to take responsibility because we are sitting inside it but we really have no ability to make an impact.

"We understand that sometimes we will succeed and sometimes less, but give the opportunity to prevent failures and take the government to good places and to do real things. We are not looking for bureaus, drivers, honor and power. We could have it, but we are not ready.

"Tell you more than that. We did not ask Netanyahu for any political price he could not pay. He did not demand health care, he put Edelstein there even though he did not ask for it, after trying to sell health to blue and white and failed. No one wants to, only on the last day, he could barely convince Miri Regev to agree to take him.

"We did not dispute him with anyone in the Likud or in the bloc. We did not ask for the religious case, so he should start a fight with Deri. We asked for real action.

"With a portfolio of nothing and nothing, you have no ability to influence or assist other ministers. For example, if I am the Minister of Transport, and I have to maintain the interests of religious Zionism vis-à-vis Aryeh Deri in appointing diners, then I know there will be mutual consideration, because the ultra-Orthodox public needs the office You will take into account my needs, and I will consider your needs, but when you hold an office that does not have the budget and authority, and no one needs it, you become a much-needed escapade.

"If we went into a place where the head of government has no interest in being satisfied, we would only be hurt by it. On the one hand, we would raise our public's expectations high - because then we are in the coalition, then they would expect achievements, and on the other, nobody would Count us, and that would be a disappointment to us. This is a political extermination area that must never be entered. "

***

So what's the story? Why doesn't he want you?

"Because he wants to be a 'one-man show,' and that he is going to very risky moves on the political issue. I fear he is going to the Dardella sovereignty of part of the Jordan Valley, and he will pay in a dangerous currency of recognition in a Palestinian state. It is a huge price that should not be paid. To the State of Israel, and he doesn't want us inside so we fight against it.

"And there is another reason. For years, there has been a deal between Netanyahu and the judicial system. He sells the treatment of the legal system for his own survival. He sold the legal system to Avi Nissenkorn, and received permission from the High Court to deal. Take Judge Esther Hayot's verdict in discussion of the coalition agreement. It's a judgment that is a huge loss to the right, there are horrible and horrible statements - the High Court says that the opinion of the Knesset members is that Justice will intervene in the appointment of the Judiciary Committee, that he can intervene and invalidate basic laws. But in the outcome - Bibi can be prime minister The right side lost, Netanyahu won.

"It's a given that he's been with the judiciary for ten years. He took pride in curbing all the bills that wanted to reform the judiciary and kept the court. He didn't want us to embarrass him, be there and fight within the coalition.

"In fact, in this government, Netanyahu has sold the entire right. They say that a bipartisan body is a monster, there is no country in the world that has two prime ministers. Netanyahu created a situation in which every vote that was voted to the right equals less than a third of the vote to the left because 19 Knesset members received the The power of 53. That's an amazing thing.

"He made a liquidation sale of everything that is important to the right to keep himself in the prime minister's seat. He did not intend to vacate his seat and let someone else from the Likud form a right-wing government, thus maintaining the camp. Lieberman would have joined if someone who was not Netanyahu headed the Likud .

"So maybe it's exaggerated. It's really a heroic act to sacrifice yourself for the right, but it's not 0 or 1. There's a great distance between saying 'I return the keys and letting someone else form a full-fledged right-wing government', and selling the elimination of everything Which is important to the right at the value level only to remain prime minister.

"I see it as a sale of the right for personal interest. You sold the right, disassembled the block, hurt the right's chances to stay in power, sold all the power and files in government and the values ​​that are important to the right to remain prime minister. To me it is illegitimate. In the bloc, in religious Zionism as the strategic partner of the Likud. "

He said the other choice was another election.

"He alone negotiated with Gantz. We gave him a month to negotiate with Gantz when he didn't update anyone. At the beginning, we had to blow up. After a month, we told him, 'Wait, let's sit together all the bloc partners, This block every day, to make a conference call half an hour before Saturday, to sign letters, so now let's sit down and negotiate together. "We agreed that rival Levin would conduct the negotiations, but on behalf of everyone. I expected him to sign with the bloc first, and only So negotiate the block with Gantz and get it at a low price.

"We made a mistake that the first day he started negotiating with Gantz, we didn't tell him, 'Stop. Either there is a block, or there is no block.' We had to make sure there was a negotiating team with representatives from all the bloc's parties, as agreed. A team that would set red lines We wanted to be extra good kids and give him credit, and he took the credit and trust we gave him and betrayed us.

"I understand there was a commitment to privacy before Gantz disbanded the partnership with Torch, but Fritti doesn't have to be just in cases. We can say we will get more cases, but on acute issues their voting will be double weight. This is how we would create equality in government and cabinet decisions.

"Gantz came to a very weak negotiation. He broke up with a torch, he had nothing to do with it. So what are you selling everything for? Why are you selling the sentences? Why are you giving in to their demand that Julie not be the Knesset Speaker? You know, he did the most ideologically correct thing, he stood in the honor of the Knesset in the face of the High Court's brutal trampling, so what do you call him wounded?

"Later, I saw publications that Gantz did not veto the appointment of Yuli Edelstein as Knesset Speaker, but Bibi did not even try. At the moment of truth, he turned our backs. I don't know what his accounts are. Perhaps a rival Levin is more loyal to him than Edelstein, I don't know. But we didn't have to agree on a partition, that's the most undemocratic thing in the world. "

Or it's all personal. Netanyahu is not crazy about Bennett and Shaked.

"Everyone who knows Netanyahu knows that you are wrong. There is no past and future for him, there is a present. With Lieberman, he also struggled on crazy levels, and then appointed him as defense minister. Look at Gantz. They killed each other in the election campaigns, and now there are hugs. And they became friends.

"We will wait for the day after Netanyahu. I hope that the day after that the trust can be built between the Likud and the religious Zionists. Netanyahu said he is leaving in a year and a half. Maybe on that day we can build a new partnership on the basis of values, respect."

***

Is there a scenario that in a month or two, Netanyahu is calling you and you into government? Like he was with Lieberman, who started the opposition and then joined?

"I do not have personal hatred or personal considerations. We want a partnership, but we will not agree that it is a partnership that is based on one party who is the landlord, and one side who is a lender who has to say 'yes' to everything. I will not humiliate the public I represent." .

So despite the harsh words, there is a chance that you will be members of his government.

"No contradiction. I said he was talented, that he brought tremendous achievements, I would not take it. He has international talent and status, he promoted the State of Israel. But that does not contradict the fact that he does not want to partner with me. Years, too much status. Maybe it's arrogance. Maybe he can't make a partnership. The ultra-Orthodox make him a major player. I come up with a complex position. We have no alternative. The ultra-Orthodox can sit with the left-wing government tomorrow. we are not".

Why did you keep signing him "affidavits" all the time?

"It was not a sign of personal loyalty to Netanyahu, it was loyalty to the right-wing camp. He is the candidate for the national camp for prime minister. Must understand: Demographically, the only chance the left can take power in the coming years is only if the right disbanded and gave it to him Money, so maintaining cohesion on the right, even if we were unable to bring 61 seats, is a guarantee that the left-wing government will not be formed but the right-wing government.

"We reckoned he would betray us, and we still did it because it was the right thing. Because we have a responsibility to the right."

There was a stage that you said, "Enough, it humiliates us."

"There was a stage we said it was starting to be like a woman who wants her husband to write to her every morning that he loves her, because if not, it's a sign he doesn't like her. Enough, enough, there's a limit. Our loyalty was undeniable, she was loyal to the road. And he turned his back on the road. "

Offended?

"No. There is no transgression in politics. Those who are offended in politics cannot last two days. I was disappointed, that is the right definition. We went a long way to preserve the right spine. It was clear that a unity government must compromise and we will not leave with all our lust in our hands. , Proportion. You got lost in the giant in this agreement. "

***

You cannot ignore the fact that in the elections you have achieved the least of all lists, six seats. You can't demand much with such a small number.

"These are six seats that Netanyahu is prime minister for. If we went with Gantz after the September elections, we would get with those six mandates the security, transportation, education and the law. We would sum up everything we want, with maintaining the existing status quo, and that is it. Kind of a partition, and the ultra-Orthodox would join us a little bit. But we didn't want to. We thought we could keep all the right and the values ​​of the right. "

Are you sorry about that today?

"No. Because someone betrayed me, I won't say 'It's a shame I didn't betray him.' We could betray and wrap it up with the 'avoid elections' ideology. We've kept loyalty to camp people, to values, to the road. I'm not sorry for that loyalty for a moment. People who did not betray when they had the ability and when they were offered, and the public would punish a person who was discovered to be not an actor of essence but a personal actor, who sold the essence to remain prime minister. "

How will this manifest itself?

"Mandates in the next election."

How many will you bring?

"I'm not a gambler. But I know we'll get stronger."

Is there a situation that you are just a little suckers?

"Idealists are not suckers. We'll wait and see, it'll pay off for us."

What will you do right now?

"We're sitting on it these days. Building an opposition strategy that will work to overthrow this government as quickly as possible. It's not the right-wing government, it's the Netanyahu government.

"Recall to the national camp day, hour, night, long filibuster, what its challenges are - sovereignty, judicial system repair, Jewish identity preservation, reformed economy. Let's see Netanyahu now fix this crazy economic crisis with Nissancorn on the committee The Ministers for Legislation and Peretz in Economy. We'll see it. I'll oblige the ultra-Orthodox to watch the Sabbath, kosher, rabbinate, conversion. "

What it means?

"I will raise a red flag for every rally. For all the railroad work on Saturday, which has not been in recent months."

No jobs on Saturdays?

"No jobs. Not on the train, not on the roads. I did it quietly, without wars. No one was angry, everything was attentive, caring. Sometimes it may cost a little more, sometimes it needs backup, but you can do all the work on Saturday.

"On Chanukah vacation, I closed in Ayalon every time one railroad, or other solutions. We did everything faster, cheaper, more professional - and did not desecrate Shabbat. Also, Jewish Bridge designed in such a way that does not require to close Ayalon routes for four days on Shabbat. As the contractor is asked to plan for cheaper or less space, a bridge can be designed without a Ayalon closure for four days. For example, in parts, this is a question of attention. "

***

Just before the end of the government train, Rabbi Rafi Peretz, chairman of the Jewish House, decided to join and receive the position of minister. Smutrich, chairman of the National Union, stayed with Bennett, Shaked, Matan Kahane and Ophir Sofer.

Where did you hear about Rabbi Rafi's departure?

"In the media, on Twitter. We knew he was negotiating, we knew he would come in and that it would be at all costs."

And what did you think of that?

"He made a bad mistake. In the end, he arranged for himself a last term and I respect him. No one thinks that in the next term, the Jewish House led by Rabbi Rafi Peretz will run alone and pass the blockade. Unfortunately, he's burying a party of a hundred years.

"He and I have signed a party merger agreement. The plan was that after the elections we would merge the two parties, because there is no justification for religious Zionism to be part of a party. Once upon a time, with hand-bending, we looked bad in the last election, but Rabbi Rafi gave divorce to the partnership, which is a death certificate to the Jewish home anyway.

"I have known Rabbi Rafi for a year. To tell the truth - there is not one political mistake he did not make in the past year. I want to keep his dignity, in the end he is a rabbi, educated a lot of students, did good things, but he is not fit for politics.

"It is time for religious Zionism to understand that politics is a profession. To this day, anyone who has been placed from above, whether from the military or from anywhere else, has failed."

And how is your relationship with Bennett?

"Excellent. Between Naftali and me there are complexities, there are different voices, that's how it is within religious Zionism. There are some and there are, there are Lights and there are Torahs, but know how to go together, and there is a future.

"I am preparing to build one large party for religious Zionism with Bennett. More religious and less religious, and also secularists and people who identify with our ideas, such as Ayelet Shaked and Shirley Pinto. To try and restore the tribal bonfire, pride, affiliation, identity, values ​​and commitment of the Zionist public. I wanted to do this with the Jewish House, which is a century-old historical brand, the Eastern Hapoel, but it will not.

"Before the last election, Naftali and I knew that we were passing the blockage, and that if Rabbi Rafi goes with Itamar Ben Gvir, he will not go through the blocking. Ben Gvir threw 18,000 votes, together they would throw 50-40,000 votes. They told me, ' Let them crash and stay alone on stage. "I said I had responsibility for all religious Zionism."

You are the ones who caused him to break the agreement with Ben Gvir, so what are you complaining about?

"I have great appreciation for Rabbi Rafi, and that is it. It hurts the Jewish home as an institution, but it is a minor blow to the wing."

Why do you think he went into government?

"He probably realized that this was his last term, with no chance of being elected by any mechanism, so he chose to be a minister rather than a simple MK. At least he would have taken a significant role as Minister of Education, something respectable. The Minister of Jerusalem is Isra'elof. Anyone who knows the office knows there is nothing there.

"Netanyahu crept it on four. A whole night they talked, and in the end he gave him a file for nothing and nothing. No budget, no authority, nothing. It's all slogans. It's a shame."

Have you talked to him since?

"No. He sat with us in a faction two days before, when we agreed on everyone's opinion, including his opinion, that Shina is continuing together, and under what conditions go to the opposition. The next day he strived to contact Netanyahu and close."

Have you been surprised?

"Go to the next question."

Still, were you surprised?

"Go to the next question."

And last try, were you surprised?

"No".

***

Smutrich was excited at the exchange at the Ministry of Transport, where he handed the baton to Miri Regev. "I fell in love with the office, the people, the doing," he says with glittering eyes, "I couldn't ask myself for a better school and teachers for a first performance role. Judging from what they say about me, I seemed to be able to do some good things, and also sanctify the name on the road ".

What is enough to do in the office in less than a year?

"I've been there for almost 11 months. It's not a long time, and we still managed to do quite a few things. There is outstanding performance ability. I leave with a taste of more, I'll be back soon."

Which office did you receive from the former Minister of Transport, Israel Katz, and which office do you transfer to Miri Regev?

"I only have good words about Israel. He was a good transport minister. He had his own accent, and I put other emphasis. For example, I put emphasis on public transport. It's not just buses. It's trains, fast lanes, smart transport, a smart management app Of public transport, beyond collaborative travel. It's a whole world. "

In an interview with this supplement a year ago, you said your goal is to bring trains to Judea and Samaria.

"We have promoted a master plan for transportation in Judea and Samaria. We put in two major bypass roads, bypass Huwwara and bypass, at NIS 700 million. The Tunnel Road is treated to more than NIS 1 billion, and there are more than 40 projects started in Judea and Samaria.

Now you will say that you are mainly concerned with your public.

"Everything I did was without any protection to Judaism. I said explicitly that I do not want Yosu to receive one more shekel than she deserves, but also not one shekel less than she deserves. To this day, Yash has thrown a bone here, a bone there. There used to be a road here and a square.

"In recent years, a basket of road criteria has been put into computer software, and it ranks the important projects. Among the criteria - risk centers, economic viability and more. We have taken the roads and intersections in Judea and Samaria, and put them in this mixer and more than 40 projects in Judea and Samaria. Highest rated. It's a revolution, that's how revolutions are made. "

You closed Dov Field, opened the Ramon airport, and that's a failure.

"I did not build the field in Ramon. The expense of the airport from Eilat and the closing of Sde Dov made the arrival in Eilat and Eilat a much less comfortable center. I opposed it with all my soul, but the prime minister decided, and that's it.

"To get the field out of Eilat is less terrible, they wanted to develop that area. The big mistake was closing the Dov field and moving to Ben Gurion Airport. We made every effort to make it as easy as possible, moved the flights to Terminal 1 and did the chattels of the plane ramp. During the Corona days I maintained a regular line to Eilat every day. A line that was subsidized with little money to keep the oxygen, Eilat in great difficulty, built from 80 percent of tourism, and was in collapse. The government will need to decide on Eilat. She is hurt like no one was hurt. "

Were you surprised that you received compliments on your office performance?

"I tried hard to work. It's better to leave when you are flattered."

How about when Miri Regev informed the office's CEO during a maternity leave that she was replacing her?

"Legitimate. The CEO is a trustee, and when he comes into office, he has the full right to replace him. Kannon Super, a first-rate professional in content and management capabilities. She spent years in the office, knowing the office. I do not get into the question of whether or not Minister Regev has made a smart move. "

***

What did you think of the functioning of the government in the Corona?

"In the first period, the ministers were dominant, and slowly it became something that is mainly going on with the prime minister and the health ministry. There were instances that were put into the picture when everything was already ready. Bringing to the chambers decisions that were already published in the media. The minister's resentment on this matter was justified.

"But I will not give Netanyahu the credit he deserves. He recognized right, acted correctly. I hear all the sages in retrospect, and they are wrong. It could have exploded to enormous proportions. The reason it did not evolve and did not topple the health system is the steps taken.

"On the other hand, the exit phase is being managed, and still managed, not well. It took a long time to produce an exit strategy. It is built from a number of vectors - proper health system preparation, economy preparedness, compensation packages. So far, people have not received compensation. The prime minister attacked the bureaucracy And the regulation, which is obstacles. Hello, you have been Prime Minister for 13 years, you have fostered the bureaucratic monster of the State of Israel. "

Minister Litzman claimed this week that there was excessive intimidation.

"He said things in the Knesset this week that, thanks to the fact that we closed and identified early, it was optimally passed. In my opinion, there was no exaggeration."

What was your part in the functioning of the government?

"I made a decision at the beginning of the crisis that extracted bailouts for Israelis. The rescued Israelis paid a lot for the flights back, and there were reasons for it. An airplane that flew empty to one side, routes changed because of places where the sky was closed.

What do you think of the government sworn in yesterday?

"I have a sense of relief that I'm not a part of it. A fat government, set up in a million unemployed period. You could say it's populism, it's not a lot of money, and still, there is public visibility. The same visibility that is important even when talking about closure on the Seder, and then hosting the children As a leader, you cannot ignore the visibility, when the economy is collapsing, the government cannot be inflated.

"Even this concept of an alternate prime minister costs so much money. Gantz has a defense ministry, and there's also an alternate prime minister's office, with the CEO and advisers. Reback, what will he do there ?! There are security convoys for both and housing for both. You crazy ?! "

If you got the bags you wanted, you wouldn't say that.

"If we were in government we would feel uncomfortable, but at least we know that we can make an impact and do it. I think most government ministers feel the same. On the day of the inauguration, except for the two joy grooms, no one was comfortable."

How about Gantz's move?

"I appreciate him. In the end, he paid a heavy personal price. In my sense, he really does it out of a real mission."

This government has spent its days?

"I don't believe it. So many contrasts, like there was with the Netanyahu Torch government in 2013, that held the least amount of time. When there is no glue, sandals each other. Bibi and Gantz can get by, because Gantz is comfortable. But there are non-suckers, It will be very difficult to survive. Think of a situation that Shmuli will bring about a surrogacy law, and the ultra-Orthodox will go wild. "

Do you still think today that a prime minister can serve with an indictment?

"Yes, I did not change. Applied Netanyahu's double standards, investigated his affairs like nobody else investigated, scoured his flesh with iron combs to find an indictment. You cannot escape the feeling that there is no pursuit of justice and justice. Democracy.

"Netanyahu's corruption is not what he is being accused of, but of betraying his voters, his camp. It's a serious public corruption."

***

This is your first time in opposition.

"Yes. I've only been in the Knesset for five years."

Shout?

"I don't think so. I'll be my business and state."

You underwent a makeover this year when you were a minister.

"No, I am the same Bezalel Smutrich. I was only given the opportunity to prove myself in a performance role. I tried to do things, and I had a faction Deshmaia. But I did not change, I am the same person. "The public has chosen it. I have used the tools I have to advance what I believe in. I am delighted at the opportunity I have been given, and that the public has been exposed to these parties."

In opposition you will have more free time. What will you do?

"I'm not at liberty. I'm going to work hard to overthrow the government and consolidate ourselves. And the family needs compensation too. I'll try to be more at home to handle the neglected things."

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