In the European Union, Katarina Barley is also clear, many protagonists are currently not splattering themselves with historical fame.
Example Afghanistan.
"Refugee policy is the black spot on the list of the European Union," said the SPD politician and Vice President of the European Parliament at a SPIEGEL event in Berlin on Wednesday.
Just this week there was a heated dispute between the EU member states over the question of whether and, if so, how many refugees should be taken in from Afghanistan.
The live event, to which subscribers were digitally connected and could ask questions, was part of Republic 21. In this program, SPIEGEL discusses the major political issues of our time before the federal election - with politicians, scientists and not lastly with his readers. Where is our place in the world? That is the question that Melanie Amann, head of the capital city office and member of the chief editor, will discuss with Barley this Wednesday.
In the central question of how to deal with the influx of refugees from all over the world, the Union has not been able to find a solution "for many, many years," Barley frankly admits. "And because we have countries like Poland, Hungary and Slovenia, which are totally blocking, there is no agreement in sight." So this time, in the case of Afghanistan, there will only be the possibility of individual countries taking the initiative seize. "Those who are of good will, so to speak, will have to get together."
Do all states still share the same set of values in the European Union, does a viewer want to know later? Barley has a clear answer to this question: "No." From her point of view, for example, Hungary is no longer a democracy. There is no longer a free media there and the electoral system has been changed in such a way that the Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orbán had a two-thirds majority last time with less than 50 percent of the vote. There are also many problems in culture, science and the judiciary.
Barley still does not think that Hungary should leave the Union "because we always have to differentiate between a government and the population." The population in Hungary and also in Poland is "traditionally very pro-European": "If we look at it historically, I have great hopes about what the Hungarian and Polish people contributed to the fall of the Iron Curtain, how they fought for their freedom. "
"We are at a fork in the road"
But what if the right-wing populist Marine Le Pen is elected French president next year in France, a reader wants to know.
"This is actually my personal nightmare," Barley replies.
“Because Poland, Hungary and Slovenia, we can somehow manage that.
But if Frenkreich tips over, we will have a huge problem. "
If Le Pen wins the election, asks another viewer, would it not be time for the "willing" to leave the EU and establish a new Union?
"That's not what I want, of course," Barley says.
"I really have faith in the European peoples that they want an open Europe at the end of the day."
But when a reader asks whether the United States' vision of Europe would have a chance of being realized in the near future, Barley says that they are currently “far away”: “We are currently at a fork in the road.
We now have to decide whether we want to remain a democratic, jointly acting, values-based Europe.
Otherwise we will fall apart and in the best case scenario we will remain a mere internal market. "
But she absolutely does not give up hope.
"I really hope for the younger generation." Because in all surveys you can see "that young people want Europe." Europe is "the greatest project we have and really our future.
And the future of our children. "
ase
