Armin Laschet or Olaf Scholz?
Because the election campaign is coming to a head, the general secretaries of the two leading parties are discussing at “Markus Lanz”.
Hamburg - "Markus Lanz" reports in a mini format on Wednesday evening after the Champions League on ZDF.
Instead of the usual four guests who discuss 75 minutes, talk show host Lanz asks the two general secretaries Paul Ziemiak (CDU) and Lars Klingbeil (SPD) for a 45-minute campaign debate.
At the beginning, they make it clear that they have a close relationship with each other.
But then SPD strategist Klingbeil says that he is currently a little worried about Ziemiak: “I've known Paul for a long time and we appreciate each other.
But when I suddenly see that people are working with anti-European resentment, then I know: this is not him.
I know that he is doing that in the role and still I think it's a shame that he has to go such a path now. "But it is explained a little by the current situation in which the Union is in," that you are now on the part of the Union falls into such a panic mode and has to hit it ”.
Laschet or Scholz?
General secretaries Ziemiak and Klingbeil wrestle with “Markus Lanz” for the right recipe for Europe
“What Lars Klingbeil means,” replies Ziemiak unimpressed and explains: “The SPD wants a debt union in the European Union. She wants a social union. This means that German pensioners, taxpayers and savers should be liable for the debts of other countries. A social system in Europe. That will not happen with us because we protect the money of German taxpayers and citizens. ”Every German can rely on the Union to take care that there is no debt union. The discussion continues: “That is really what shocks me,” replies Klingbeil, “because I know Paul, because I know that he is a staunch European. But one sentence he said that the German taxpayers should now pay money for the Romanian pensioners is anti-European resentment that is being fed there.You are clearly campaigning against Europe and I find that incredibly unworthy. "
The fact that the Union wants to go back to the debt brake calls into question the success of the joint legislature for Klingbeil, but Ziemiak contradicts: “That was unique.
And for a limited time.
Due to the corona pandemic.
At that moment it was right, which is why I voted for it myself.
But that cannot be a permanent condition, otherwise we will slide into it and we will not get more stability in Europe, but less stability. "
"Markus Lanz" - these were his guests on September 15th:
Paul Ziemiak (CDU) - politician
Lars Klingbeil (SPD) - politician
Klingbeil replies that there is already a social union in Europe: “And it is also right that we have a common social policy in Europe. That we say there must be a minimum wage everywhere. That we say that there must also be protection against unemployment everywhere. Wage dumping in Europe must be combated. That we say there must be social security systems everywhere. That we say that the task must be to fight child poverty everywhere in Europe, to fight youth unemployment. That’s what defines Europe. That we show solidarity for one another. But the impression that is created here is: Germany pays for the rest. And that's nonsense. ”Klingbeil's concern:“ If we don't get stronger in Europe, together, then we will lose the competition against China, against the USA, against other.And that's why Europe must grow closer together. "
"We see in these essential questions," says Ziemiak, "that we can only keep a strong Europe if we also take into account the opinions of the individual national states." and says: “Yes, but sorry, we have to be more strong in foreign policy, in defense policy, where you are blocking your way, against common standards of arms exports and other things, we have to be strong! We have to be strong, for example, on the question of transatlantic trade agreements. The SPD just barely managed to agree to the free trade agreement with Canada at all. Large parts of the SPD railed against TTIP, the free trade agreement with the USA. And now I don't want this Europe to be weakenedbecause together we give up what we have agreed, the stability criteria for the economic framework, and incur debts, debts, debts and Germany and other countries are liable. "
Election campaign between the SPD and CDU comes to a head with “Markus Lanz”: to continue the European reconstruction fund or not?
Lanz makes sure and asks Klingbeil again: “Debt union: Is that what you are planning to do as the SPD?” He replies calmly: “No.
We think that what has now been initiated in this legislature, that a common investment policy is taking place in Europe with the reconstruction fund, that there must also be opportunities to stabilize this.
We have jointly decided in Parliament that Europe should, for example, also be able to collect taxes on its own.
We decided that together, they don't want to know that anymore. "
When Klingbeil said that Europe had to take another step towards integration, the moderator was gripped by it: Actually, the two were on the same line, so they were leading a pseudo-conflict that in truth did not even exist.
From Klingbeil's point of view, this can be explained by the Union's red socks campaign before the federal elections: “What is at stake is, on the pretext of a debt union, to mobilize one's own camp.
That is what they are saying right now: The Socialists want to spend your money and therefore all of them now against the SPD. "
“Markus Lanz” - the conclusion of the show
“Markus Lanz” invites you to the General Secretaries' Summit: Lanz bathes with relish for 45 minutes in a heated duel between Paul Ziemiak (CDU) and Lars Klingbeil (SPD). Starting with the different attitudes towards European social policy to an analysis of the previous election campaigns of the candidates Armin Laschet (CDU) and Olaf Scholz (SPD) to the question of political communication - Ziemiak and Klingbeil are campaigning for the final votes eleven days before the federal election with great commitment .