Thomas Guénolé is a political scientist, lecturer at Sciences Po and a doctorate in Political Science (CEVIPOF). A former member of La France Insoumise,
he published
The Black Book of Globalization: 400 Million Deaths
(Plon, 2020) and
Sovereignism
in the Que sais-je collection?
(PUF, 2022)
.
FIGAROVOX. - First of all, can you give us the definition of sovereignty?
Thomas Guénolé. -
Sovereignty is a political doctrine advocating the independence of a nation, its autonomy, or an increase in autonomy, vis-à-vis a level of power which overhangs it. The concept appeared in Quebec in the 1960s, but sovereignism already existed
de facto
long before: Haiti's independence from France at the end of the 18th century, for example.
There are therefore many sovereignist movements across the globe and throughout history.
Quebec sovereignism vis-à-vis the Canadian federal state, Kanak sovereignty vis-à-vis the French unitary state, various national sovereignties vis-à-vis the European Union, Serbian sovereignty in the Ottoman Empire, or even Indian sovereignty vis-à-vis the European Union. British colonial empire, to name a few.
Do you mean Gandhi was a sovereignist?
Sure.
He campaigned for the independence of the Indian nation against the overhanging power of the British, which therefore made him an Indian sovereignist.
He wrote a book at the beginning of the 20th century called
Hind Swaraj
, which literally means “sovereign India”.
I also devote in the book a case study to the definition of the sovereign Indian nation according to Gandhi, which is very interesting.
More broadly, any political movement pleading for independence, autonomy or more autonomy for the nation it wants to defend can be qualified as sovereignist;
the separatists of the American War of Independence, for example.
You explain in your book that there are four main families of sovereignty. What is it about ?
There are in fact four main types of sovereignty: ethnocultural, civic, Marxist-revolutionary, and economic.
The first three differ in the way they define the nation they want to defend.
For ethnocultural sovereignty, the nation is an organic, cultural community before being political, based on customs, traditions and language.
The sovereignisms which worked the Empire of Austria-Hungary, in particular Hungarian and Czech, are very good examples.
For civic sovereignty, the nation is neither cultural nor organic: it is contractual. It is a political community of citizens, who recognize its existence, who agree to belong to it, and who collectively want it to continue to exist. American sovereignty against the British colonial power is a textbook case: the independence of the nation is proclaimed only in the name of the common will of the citizens that it exists.
For Marxist-revolutionary sovereignty, sovereignty is not an end in itself, it is a means at the service of the revolution.
Obtaining independence or autonomy is a simple tool to accomplish the revolution somewhere.
Vietnamese sovereignty in the face of the French colonial empire, with Hồ Chí Minh as its leader, is a good example.
[Economic sovereignty] advocates national economic independence, or at least more autonomy, vis-à-vis this planetary economic system - mainly through protectionism.
Thomas Guénolé
Economic sovereignty is a special case for two reasons.
On the one hand, he is not interested in the definition of the nation.
On the other hand, it is the “unfortunate globalization” that he sees as a political power overhanging the nations.
In response, he advocates national economic independence, or
at least
more autonomy, vis-à-vis this planetary economic system - mainly through protectionism.
The last chapter of your book is a brief history of sovereignty in France. As the presidential election approaches, in your opinion, who best embodies sovereignty today in France?
It all depends on which of the four sovereignties we are talking about.
The main standard-bearer of French ethnocultural sovereignty today is Eric Zemmour, because the leitmotif of his candidacy is national cultural identity.
The best-known representative of civic sovereignty today is Arnaud Montebourg, in the continuity of Jean-Pierre Chevènement - even if the most striking sovereignist-civic discourse in recent French political history remains that of the late Philippe Séguin, at the National Assembly, May 5, 1992, against the Maastricht Treaty.
To read also From Montebourg to Mélenchon, sovereignty moves on the left
Because of his “plan A, plan B” proposal against the European Union, Jean-Luc Mélenchon falls roughly in the tradition of Marxist-revolutionary sovereignty: the goal is revolution, if possible at European level. , and failing that by recovering more national sovereignty. Sovereignism is therefore indeed an instrument at the service of the revolution, and not an end in itself.
As for economic sovereignty, all sovereignists without exception plead it.
This is also another particularity of this sovereignty: since it is not interested in the definition of the nation, it is the only one of the four that can be pleaded by all the others.
In my opinion, this is the main reason why economic sovereignty is clearly hegemonic today among the four families of sovereignty.
Sovereignism
, Thomas Guénolé, Que sais-je ?, PUF, 2022, 128 p., € 9 (Que sais-je?, 2022)
