Streeck argues in "Lanz" very differently than Lauterbach: "Must have recovered status ..."

Created: 2022-01-26Updated: 2022-01-26 10:33 AM

The guests at "Markus Lanz" © Screenshot: ZDF/"Markus Lanz"

Corona rules, joy and sorrow in the CDU and allegations against the media: Daniel Günther, Boris Palmer and Hendrick Streeck ensure an entertaining debate on “Markus Lanz”.

Hamburg – Schleswig-Holstein's Prime Minister Daniel Günther (CDU) takes a position on the Max Otte (CDU) cause with "Markus Lanz" right at the beginning of the program.

The AfD had proposed the politician as a candidate for the office of Federal President.

Otte rejected calls for this to be rejected.

"Fortunately, our statutes are clear," says Günther, "if someone lets another party propose them against the Union's proposal, then that's it.

Therefore it is now also right to exclude him.”

Max Otte should be thrown out of the CDU – party colleague Daniel Günther: “There are no two opinions”

“Does that mean you are seeking a party exclusion procedure?

How confident are you that this will go through?

There are high legal hurdles to overcome," asks talk show host Markus Lanz.

"They really are," agrees Günther, but says: "But here it's just plain clear.

There are no two opinions." Günther refers to the internal party resolutions of the Union: "We have clearly proclaimed that we have nothing in common with the AfD *, no cooperation is possible.

And anyone who hasn't understood that in the CDU simply has no place with us either." "You mean you're kicking him out?" Lanz asks again, Günther nods: "Exactly."

When asked about his new party leader Friedrich Merz (CDU), it becomes clear that the relationship between Günther and Merz could be better.

The moderator reads several quotes that document Günther's change from Merz opponent to Merz supporter.

Günther: "I would say that Friedrich Merz and I have both developed further." Host Lanz then laughs cheekily, Günther agrees and adds: "No, but it's not a compelling contradiction either.

In fact, I would still sign every sentence today, embedded in the context of the time.

Because I had an attitude in my party.

I have always supported Armin Laschet and I was also annoyed by some of Friedrich Merz's statements. "You have this fatal tendency to honesty," says the cheerful moderator.

CDU politician Günther speaks out on "Markus Lanz" for a dual leadership of the Union faction: "Other parties show that it works"

"Does that mean you are convinced of Friedrich Merz?" Lanz asked again.

Günther affirms that the CDU can benefit from Merz's rhetorical skill and leadership.

Host Lanz doesn't understand that: "That means if he's that good, then you really should be totally in favor of him taking over the chairmanship of the group, right?"

"There are different philosophies," Günther replies, "my philosophy is that this idea from the 90s, that one party has to combine all the power in one position - that was still the basic DNA of the Union - I believe that is no longer mandatory today.

Other parties are also showing that you can still present yourself with several heads.” “It is interesting that you are considering a dual leadership,” the journalist Cerstin Gammelin listens and pursues the idea further: “So dual leadership Merz /Brinkhaus?” “Exactly,” replies Günther, “that’s a model I could imagine.”

"Markus Lanz" - these were his guests on January 25th:

• Daniel Günther (CDU*)

  – politician

• Boris Palmer (Greens*)

  – politician

• Cerstin Gammelin

  – journalist

• Corinna Milborn

  – journalist

• Prof. Hendrik Streeck

  - virologist

Corona debate at Lanz: "Do we want that?"

“It would also work in Germany,” says the virologist Hendrik Streeck in the subsequent Corona* discussion with a view to the PCR tests and the comparison with Austria’s capital Vienna, in which twice as much is tested as in all of Germany.

But Streeck asks: "Do we want that?

This testing without cause, as we are seeing in the PCR area, can also cause problems.

We have a phase when you are infectious and can pass on the virus.

We can prove this very well with the PCR and the antigen test.

But then the viral load goes down, then humans are no longer infectious, but then there is a very long rat tail where we can still detect RNA in the throat, but it is no longer relevant.” “That means the PCR test does it still work?” Talkmaster Lanz explains the situation.

"I agree",

Because antigen tests do not have this flaw, they are even more useful than PCR tests from a medical point of view, as long as they are tested frequently, explains Streeck.

The PCR test is particularly important as an exclusion criterion for symptoms of Covid-19, says the virologist.

"That's a really interesting argument," says host Lanz.

On the other hand, the journalist Corinna Milborn reports from Vienna via video link: “The fact that the PCR tests continue to work for weeks is not a problem, because if the CT value is positive, you get it thrown out as well.

From a CT value of 30 you can move again, you can go back to work, you are no longer in quarantine.”

Corona debate at “Markus Lanz”: no rules, but compulsory vaccination?

"So PCR for advanced users," says talkmaster Lanz, not without envy - and Milborn can add: "We even evaluate the virus variants in Vienna. So you also know whether it's Omicron or Delta - or the rare Alpha variant, which is sometimes also included." "You just have to say that, it's really a very pragmatic solution in Austria," praises Streeck, as does Günther finds the Austrian way “exciting and pragmatic”. This path also includes a general obligation to vaccinate, which will apply from February 1st. One day before the compulsory vaccination orientation debate in the German Bundestag, Daniel Günther spoke to "Markus Lanz" in favor of general compulsory vaccination from the age of 18.

"I think it's the right thing to do.

I would also wish that we could really make faster progress there.

I also can't understand why federal politics is a bit rabbit-footed," says Günther, meaning Chancellor Olaf Scholz * (SPD): "The Chancellor does not cover himself with fame on the subject." Tübingen's Mayor Boris Palmer (Greens) would would like to go one step further and abolish all the rules – in exchange for compulsory vaccination as the only rule: “We need something other than an increasingly bureaucratic individual case regulation that creates absurd excesses.”

Green Mayor Boris Palmer on "Markus Lanz": "I'm fed up"

Boris Palmer (Greens) as a guest on "Markus Lanz" (ZDF).

© ZDF (Screenshot)

"To be honest, I'm fed up too," Palmer vents about his Corona annoyance and adds: "I don't want to be tormented with this bureaucracy for many more years. I have entrepreneurs in town who want to create something. I also don't want to constantly administer bans and send the regulatory office everywhere.” “And whoever doesn't get vaccinated will be sanctioned?” Lanz wants to know. Palmer looks to the neighboring country, where fines start at 600 euros: “The Austrian way is pragmatic. I like it anyway, pragmatic solutions are municipal solutions.”

Palmer goes on to explain that vaccination is a civic duty for him: “And this duty, in my opinion, must now be clearly written into law.

My suggestion: two to three times for the over-50s, then we can get out of this pandemic.” “In terms of the idea”, Günther also agrees with this idea towards the end of the show, “I think that’s absolutely right” .

Addressing Streeck, Lanz asks: "Would that convince you?" "But we can't vaccinate the pandemic away with it," says the virologist, "we see that very clearly with the variant developments.

We will have a wave again next year.

If you look at it purely from the variants and immunologically, we are currently vaccinating against a variant that no longer exists, the Wuhan variant.

Streeck on "Markus Lanz" on ZDF: "We treat the recovered status very neglectfully"

Streeck adds to the recovered status: "We treat it very neglectfully, where we actually know from the studies that reinfections occur on average after around 300 days - of course it can also come earlier." But everyone who has recovered would have a very good protection against a severe course.

Reinfection would occur very seldom compared to infection after vaccination, "at least from the studies up to Omicron that you have an overview of".

Streeck's conclusion: "So we actually have to equate the recovered status with the vaccination status."

Then Lanz gets on and explains again that the convalescent status in Germany has now been reduced from six to three months. There was a lot of criticism in Germany, also because the announcement came at very short notice. Health Minister Karl Lauterbach defended the move. "I don't understand that," said the talk show host, referring to other countries. Streeck continues his argument and also wishes that antibody tests be accepted as proof of a recovered status.

It is not exactly clear who has been vaccinated in Germany and who has recovered, the group notes.

"We don't know who has protection and we don't even know what percentage of the population we are actually talking about with which we want to introduce such draconian measures as compulsory vaccination.

I'm worried that we're running after something to push something through, a desired vaccination rate where nobody can say how high it should actually be," says Streeck.

Lanz notes that Streeck advises the government and thus above all Lauterbach as a member of the expert council.

"They obviously have different opinions," the moderator says.

Streeck dodges: "In the end, the decision is made by politics."

Boris Palmer raises serious allegations, Streeck agrees

How deep some stings of the pandemic years are revealed towards the end of the show. Palmer explains to Streeck: "I find it really exciting because in two years of this pandemic I was always happy to see you on TV so that the panic orchestra doesn't play so loud." Lanz laughs, but Palmer insists on his point : "He was defamed for a long time, there were

stories that were only intended for destruction." "Well, well, well," interjects Gammelin, but Streeck can't resist a "yes" in their direction.

"Now he's on the Expert Council* and luckily he's recognized again," summarizes Palmer, "I think it's great that rehabilitation like this is possible."

As the show's bouncers, talkmasters Lanz and Streeck cast the shadow of an upcoming debate.

Lanz asks: "How often can you give such a vaccination?

Every half year?

Every year?” Streeck: “We don't know.

And that's exactly the problem, that we haven't penetrated so deeply into immunology to understand the effects exactly."

"Markus Lanz" - The conclusion of the show

Markus Lanz, in a good mood, announces "a jam-packed show" on Tuesday evening and does not disappoint.

With Schleswig-Holstein's Prime Minister Daniel Günther (CDU), the moderator looks at the new CDU party leader Friedrich Merz, who has a party exclusion procedure against Max Otte in front of his chest.

In the subsequent corona debate, Tübingen's mayor Boris Palmer (Greens) presents his controversial ideas, calls for a speedy end to the corona bureaucracy and says to the virologist Hendrik Streeck: "I need a solution now and can't wait another six months until you have completed the next study.”