Defector from the Wagner group details the brutal executions he witnessed 4:09
(CNN) --
Two ex-combatants from the Russian private military company Wagner told CNN about their horrifying experiences on the battlefield in eastern Ukraine, and how anyone who hesitated was promptly shot by their own commanders.
The two fighters were captured by Ukrainian forces late last year.
CNN is not revealing their identities for their own safety.
They are both married with children and were recruited while in prison.
One was serving a 20-year sentence for manslaughter.
For security reasons, the Ukrainians maintained a presence in the room where the interview took place.
CNN told the fighters that they could end the interview any time they wanted.
But they talked in detail for more than an hour.
The two fighters spoke of horrific losses in "first wave" attacks reminiscent of World War I charges.
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“We were 90. Sixty died in that first attack, killed by mortar fire.
A handful were wounded,” said one, recalling his first assault near the town of Bilohorivka.
“If one group is unsuccessful, another is dispatched immediately.
If the second one is unsuccessful, they send another group.”
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The other fighter was involved in a five-day assault through a forest near the town of Lysychansk, on the Luhansk-Donetsk border in eastern Ukraine.
“The first steps in the forest were difficult because of all the scattered land mines.
Out of 10 guys, seven died immediately,” he said.
“You cannot help the wounded.
The Ukrainians were firing heavily at us, so even if their wounds were light, you have to keep going, otherwise you're the one taking fire."
“You're at it for five days, people dying next to me, praying to God, begging for water.
You think you can put down your gun and nothing else will happen.
And then the fight starts again 10 minutes later, and [the Ukrainians] are still chasing you.
There is no feeling associated with it.
Just wave after wave."
"400 [Wagner fighters] were brought there, and then more and more, all the time."
The graves of fighters from Russia's mercenary group Wagner at a cemetery near the village of Bakinskaya in Krasnodar region, Russia, on January 22, 2023. (Credit: Reuters)
The prisoner said that a self-defense instinct had kicked in in him, but others froze.
“Some stop right there in the woods and drop their weapons.
But to drop your weapons is to fall under sniper fire and die."
There was no evacuation of the wounded, he added.
"If you're hurt, you first get away on your own, however you can, to some neutral place where there's no fire, and if there's no one around, you administer first aid," he said.
The casualties were piling up by the dozens, the men said.
“When the casualties come, you get orders to load them and you don't really think about who is dead and who is wounded,” said one of the fighters.
Throughout their several weeks at the front, the two men said they had only one instinct.
“Just survive.
I just had the desire to survive, no matter the cost," said the prisoner involved in the forest attack.
They became desensitized to the casualties and death of the Ukrainian soldiers they faced.
"You'd think I'd feel something [after killing someone], but no, keep going."
The alternative to walking through minefields into Ukrainian artillery was just as deadly, according to the men's accounts.
"We could not leave without orders because if we do not comply with the order, they will kill us," said one of the prisoners.
“A man stayed in one position, he was really scared, it was his first attack.
We receive an order to run forward.
But the man hid under a tree and refused.
This was reported to command and that was it.
He was taken 50 meters from the base.
He was digging his own grave and then he was shot.”
The other fighter recounted a similar situation: “Our commander was told that if someone chickened out, they would have to be eliminated.
And if we don't manage to eliminate him, we would be eliminated for not having killed him."
the promise of freedom
The two men described how they were recruited by Wagner.
In August and September of last year, the head of the group, Yevgeny Prigozhin, arrived by helicopter at the prisons where they were being held, offering six-month contracts in exchange for pardon.
One of the men still had 10 years in jail ahead of him after a manslaughter conviction.
“I thought that six months was better than the 10 or 11 years that I could still spend in prison… I just wanted a fresh start in life,” he said.
At that time, Prigozhin's recruitment drive in Russia's prisons was in full swing.
Western intelligence officials and prison advocacy groups estimate that 40,000 to 50,000 men were recruited.
On Thursday, Prigozhin said the prison recruitment campaign had ended, but gave no reason.
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“Only a handful in my unit came for money, most of them came because they had long sentences,” said one of the fighters.
"But there were also some who only had 12 days left on their sentence, and they left anyway."
“They lined up everyone in the yard, and Prigozhin started recruiting people,” he said.
“[Prigozhin] said that he had the authority from higher bodies to release anyone from prison, regardless of the crimes or sentence.
The ideal candidates are murderers, thieves."
The selection process was so rudimentary that older inmates only had to prove they could walk a few meters, one inmate said.
"They took almost everyone."
“Some of them were mental cases… the crazy ones, the ones that when they have a gun in their hands they don't know how to handle it,” he added.
For prisoners with years to serve, the offer was tempting.
One of the prisoners said: “For our freedom we had to fight for six months in Ukraine, to fight against the Nazis.
At the same time, he promised us salaries, loan repayments and a clean record.
Russian President Vladimir Putin has repeatedly promoted the unfounded rhetoric of "denazification" as a justification for his invasion of Ukraine.
Shortly after Prigozhin's visits, hundreds of prisoners were taken by bus and plane to a training camp in Russia's Rostov region, according to the two men.
There was a strict ban on drugs and alcohol, one of the inmates said.
Some of the commanders said that they had fought for Wagner in Africa and Syria.
The training was short and basic: weapons handling for the terrifying attacks they would soon be ordered to carry out.
The men said it was clear they were being groomed for missions they had not signed up for.
Now they are embittered by the hoaxes in Prigozhin's sales proposal.
“He did not mention anything about the danger,” said one.
"He talked about expunging all the convictions, we would serve six months, all the convictions would be expunged, an advance payment of 240,000 rubles (about $3,300) and also that our task was to keep the defense in the second line."
Military academy cadets cover the coffin with flags during the funeral of a Wagner Group mercenary killed in Ukraine at a cemetery in Saint Petersburg, Russia, on December 24, 2022. (Credit: Igor Russak/Reuters)
The two men also feel misled about the nature of the conflict.
“We thought we would be fighting Poles and various German mercenaries.
We do not think that there was anyone left in the Ukrainian Army there.
We thought they had left the country,” said one.
“Then it became clear that they were just making up lies so that we would go into battle with the Ukrainians.
Nobody really thought that the AFU [Armed Forces of Ukraine] would really fight for their own country, for their loved ones.
We only learned this after going in there."
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It was almost a relief to be caught, the prisoners said.
One said that he and a wounded comrade were the only survivors of his group, caught "between two Ukrainian mortars and a sniper."
“The command ordered me to entrench myself in my position, so I entrenched myself in my position, waiting for the evacuation.
They sent out a group of 10 and the sniper took out all 10,” he recalled.
"Then the command told us through the walkie-talkie: Get out however you can, you are alone."
It was then, he said, that the Ukrainian soldiers "came up and shot next to my foot, they said 'hands up' and that was it."
When asked if they would make the same decision again, the prisoners paused for a moment.
“I think it was a wrong choice… I had never participated in any military operations, especially fighting against the AFU, who refuse to cede their land.
They brought us here under the wrong pretext.
So we are at war, but I don't think it's a just cause,” said one.
The other prisoner agreed.
“I don't think he was worth it.
Now I hope I can turn the page."
He said that he had been able to communicate with his family since he was taken prisoner.
“They thought I was dead, until I contacted them.
They cried and were surprised that he was alive.
Both men said they wanted to return to Russia.
One said: "I don't care about Russia, I just want to go home."
Wagner