On Russian state TV, there is a heated discussion about the goal in the Ukraine war. Different ideas of a "Russian victory" collide.
Moscow - Even after more than a year of war against Ukraine, there does not seem to be a unified idea among the Russian public about what a "Russian victory" could look like in concrete terms. There seems to be no consensus either on the goal of the Ukraine war or on the military action required for it - as a heated discussion on Russian state TV shows. Even propagandists loyal to the Kremlin are now apparently reaching their limits in view of the course of the war.
Sacrifice for Putin's victory: Should "all your children be pulverized in the trenches?"
Ukrainian-born journalist Julia Davis regularly analyzes Russian state TV broadcasts to expose Kremlin propaganda regarding the Ukraine war. In a column for the US website The Daily Beast, she now describes a heated discussion on the talk show "The Meeting Place" on the Russian de facto state broadcaster NTV - which belongs to the state-owned Gazprom Group. The broadcast makes it clear that there is no consensus in Russia either on the goal of the Ukraine war or on its means.
Vladimir Putin. © Gavriil Grigorov/ imago-images
In the show, talk show host Andrei Norkin talks about the impatience and lack of understanding of the Russian population regarding the course of the war in Ukraine. During his travels through the country, he is always asked: "Why is it taking so long, why is there no more decisive action?" And he adds: "To put it bluntly, why don't we destroy them like rats?"
Russian political scientist Victor Olevich reacted very drastically to this statement on the air: "You know, when you say that your audience, your viewers, ask you why we don't take a tougher line, I would ask them a question: are you ready for all your children to die and be pulverized in the trenches? Do you want everyone to end up there?".
Olevich had often been critical of the Kremlin's war propaganda. In October 2022, for example, he had said on Russian television that Russia had misjudged its forces and that Vladimir Putin could no longer win the war. Asked about previous statements in which Olevich called for a strong bombardment of Ukraine, he said on the talk show that this strategy is no longer relevant "because Russia currently lacks resources to establish control over Ukraine and it will not receive these resources in the near future."
Russian population divided in polls on Ukraine war
It is doubtful whether the Russian population is actually calling for a tougher approach by the Russian military in the Ukraine war, as reported by the presenter. As survey figures from the Russian polling institute Levada-Center suggest, the Russian public does indeed seem to be divided on the war in Ukraine. The polling institute is considered independent of the Russian state, but the extent to which opinion polls in an authoritarian state can reflect the true views of the respondents is controversial.
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The latest survey publications by the Levada Center from March 2023 show a divided mood among the Russian population: 72 percent of respondents support the actions of the Russian armed forces in Ukraine, only 20 percent reject it completely or somewhat oppose it. At the same time, however, 48 percent are in favor of starting peace negotiations, while 42 percent are in favor of a "continuation of military action." Putin's popularity, on the other hand, does not seem to be diminished by the course of the war: 83 percent approve of the Russian president's actions, only 14 percent reject them, according to the Levada poll results.
Russia's complete victory discussed on state TV
Meanwhile, Russian state TV is hotly discussing not only the war strategy, but also the goal of the Ukraine war. Duma deputy Alexander Kazakov said on the program "The Meeting Place" that the war should end only with a complete victory of Russia. "I am for peace, I am against war. I am for peace after our victory." The politician also explained what such a Russian victory could look like: "If we reach the borders of NATO through our military or diplomatic efforts, Ukraine will disappear from the political map," Kazakov said.
"As a result, the United States is withdrawing from Eurasia and, together with China, India and other leading countries on this continent, we will establish our own rules." An even more extreme war goal was conjured up by Bogdan Bezpalko, a member of the Kremlin's Council on Interethnic Relations. According to him, Russia's war goal is "the destruction of Ukrainian nationality." For co-host Ivan Trushkin, "eliminating a threat" is the goal of the war: "Whatever that looks like, whether we reach certain limits or sign some kind of agreement, we should stop feeling an existential threat to our nation. That would be a victory," he said.
Criticism of Russian warfare: Bakhmut not a success
Former State Duma deputy Boris Nadezhdin, on the other hand, was critical of Russian fantasies of conquest. Bakhmut is a deterrent example, the city of 70,000 inhabitants is completely abandoned and destroyed. Everyone who was able to flee did so. "If victory means capturing ruins without the people, I don't know who needs such a victory," Nadezhdin said. On the Russian side, the consequences of the war are also being felt: "In some Russian cities, they are running out of men," he added. "The sooner this horror ends, the better it will be for Ukrainians and Russians alike." (kasa)
