Manny Aviram "Batik Talk"/Walla! system, Reuven Castro
"About a day or two after the massacre, we realized that something was happening here, something very, very big that we still cannot understand at all, and that we had to be there and document it in some way. Whether it was the party, the abductees, the army. We just went out to film," says the director of the production house Kastina, about how the film "Nova" was born, which aired a few weeks after the start of the war and became the most watched docu-film since the establishment of yes somewhere over two decades ago.
Aviram has served for the past eight years as the CEO of the company that, among other things, brought the acclaimed "The One" to the screen, "The Cook" which won buzz, "Bloody Murray" and also (as a co-production with "Tender Productions") the first season which paved the extraordinary success of "Fauda" which was sold to Netflix.
At the end of a successful creative year and in his first interview since he took office, Aviram tells on the Tiktok podcast of the Israel Press Institute about how the war completely changed the office's agenda for the years to come, and what is the secret of the success of "Hatabah" right now, how is it that Shrutam Sela became the house actress and what The next fantasy.
Part of the conversation is presented here in the article.
Listen or watch the full conversation.
"And despite that, there are people who haven't seen 'Nova' yet, and even among those who have, I know a lot of people who stop in the middle or can't continue"
You started 2023 with "the one" that dealt with the Yom Kippur omission and received a lot of praise and appreciation.
At 7/10 you realize that we are in a more serious default.
When did you decide on a practical level that you were making a film about it?
"It's bigger than that, because we have a fairly large documentary department and the heart of our work is documentary. Two days after the massacre, we actually decided that we were going to document a lot of these segments. Whether it was the party, the abductees, the army. We just went out to film with the assumption and understanding that we would be successful after that to offer it to broadcasters who wanted. A few days later, the creator of the film, Dan Parr, contacted us and offered to collaborate, told us what he had, and from there it evolved into 'Nova.' Broadcasting in Israel".
The choice not to intervene or to film the footage, similar to the atrocity film produced by the IDF spokesman, explain it to me
. thing, that speaks for itself.
And really chronologically, when you see this thing with a beginning, middle and end, you get the very, very clear feeling of the party and what those who were there experienced, I think that's the strength of the film.
"And despite that, there are people who haven't seen it yet, and even among those who have seen it, I know a lot of people who stop in the middle or can't continue. In the end, it's all fantastic. This thing, it's still fantastic that it happened to us, that we live in this thing. Obviously, it's a very, very watchable Hard".
The film also became a victim of inter-corporate politics, when Keshet gave up the offer to broadcast it for free in the background of a commercial dispute they had with yes.
You work quite a bit with Keshet, were you upset that the biggest broadcaster in Israel didn't put this film in the spotlight?
"No, absolutely not. First of all, Keshet is our natural home, Kastina and Keshet are connected, we're friends with them. Look, we were so crazy about this thing and Weiss made the decision with us, but they actually initiated it, to give it away for free To all the broadcasters. Those who wanted took, those who didn't wanted didn't, so I didn't get into it in real time, because it doesn't really matter. Anyone who wanted to see this film had somewhere, including YouTube of course."
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To the full article
The most watched movie in history yes.
"Nova"/screenshot, yes
war board
I want to dive for a moment into the impact of the war on the screen.
Only now are we seeing commercial television starting to get back on its feet, after it tried for two months to get started and to start, but you are at the head of a production house that thinks two or three years ahead. Try to describe to me how much the war is present in the future broadcast schedule in Israel.
"So first of all There are the worlds of what is happening now in the war and there is the routine.
During the war, as I said, we do quite a few projects for all kinds of broadcasters, almost all the broadcasters in Israel.
We set out and they took it, so we edit and shoot at the same time, besides, there is actually our routine, which includes things that were born long before the war, and which the broadcasters are supposed to broadcast and we continue to work on them.
Look, the main thing created - it's a traffic jam, for most broadcasters.
Products that were supposed to be broadcast already, were rejected, and now we are trying to figure out where to insert them."
Give me an example.
"I think the race to say a million should have started.
There is a series, which I hope there will be, actually I know it will be amazing.
A monumental series by Doron Zabri about Avitar Banai Bis, and it was supposed to be broadcast already and the war somewhat spoiled the cards.
I know of things, in the worlds of drama, not necessarily ours, that were supposed to be already and could not be broadcast, so they were postponed to a later date, and thus the broadcasters are actually less likely to launch things at the moment, because there is a queue that they have not yet broadcast.
" You are present in the worlds of the drama, will the following characters be in the shadow
of the massacre? "Currently we are writing series, but it is not really deeply affected by this thing, because these are not series related to these issues.
Let's say Bloody Murray 2 will not be affected by the war.
But outside of the worlds of drama, all the projects are about the war, and I gave one small example, and the event there will find its place in the series."
Give me an example of a project that deals with the war and that is in the works.
"We have a film for the Rainbow about the story of the former Gali commander of the IDF Shimon Alkavetz in the Gaza village where his daughter was murdered. This is actually the story of what happened that morning to his daughter through his eyes. We have another series for another major broadcaster that returns on the seventh of October, and of course we have the big project with Sheryl Sandberg (VP of Facebook International) to the former D.V.) which is intended for broadcast abroad.
"This is a project that we initiated together with Eitan Schwartz on the subject of Hamas's sexual violence, in war and in captivity. We raised money from an investor and after all kinds of thought, we made an offer to Sandberg, a former number two in Meta, who is identified with the struggle on the issue."
It is interesting because Facebook received quite a bit of criticism after the massacre, also against the background of the well-known claims of the contribution of social networks to polarization and the creation of violent discourse, and also because it actually allowed the terrorists to broadcast the atrocities LIVE.
Does she refer to the subject?
"No. In the end, my goal was to try to get her to do this thing. I am in contact with a great many parties abroad, I see how they look at us, what they are willing to accept, what they are not willing to accept.
The very fact that we tried and succeeded in connecting someone like Sheryl Sandberg to this thing, I think it's going to be one of the most important films ever to come out of the State of Israel and the very fact that she agreed to put herself into it, for me, this is a crazy achievement and it's above all.
"Discussions, good Facebook, bad Facebook, it's not relevant to this specifically, I guess she will be asked in the future, she is also asked all the time, but I appreciate and am grateful that she agreed and she will and will be kidnapped for this, that is, a lot of her environment and the United States Attacking her for how she connected to this thing."
"The story of what happened that morning through his eyes."
Daughter of the late Shimon Elkabetz/Government Press Office
"Obviously there was a lot of fuss about it, and I say this as someone who looks for what is being written about the series on Facebook and Twitter and so on, and finds out that it is the last thing that pops up because it costs you a 'slaughter' in everything"
In a sharp transition, let's talk about "the cook".
Which I admit I really, really liked.
I guess there was a dilemma whether to air the second season after the war.
"True. In fact, this is the first drama series that appeared in Israel after the war. Yes, there were discussions, there were thoughts, in the end I think we all felt that it could be done, that there was some need for people. After all, I think that Israel is the craziest country in the world, There is nothing we can do, we live here in something that no one can understand if he is not here. Our life is such a duplicity of the craziest war, the most terrible thing that has happened to us, that it is impossible to contain it and I tell you as someone who deals with this issue in full projects and films, it is still impossible to contain it, no matter how much I see, it is unfathomable.
"And on the other hand, our lives go on, that is, we have children, there is school, there is work, there is a livelihood and we return home, or some of us return home in the evening and they say - okay, I'm in this thing all day, I want something, another moment, this thing is not insulting, it's not offensive in any way, it doesn't step on the toes that can be sensitive, and I think it's proven itself.
" I bet you even had a dilemma about the name, whether it should be dotted or not, so much so
.
And of course there was a lot of insistence on this, and I say this as someone who searches for what is being written about the series on Facebook and Twitter, etc., and discovers that it is the last thing that pops up because you get the 'slaughter' of everything.
There was a discussion about it, but in the end, after there is the talk about the name and whether it is the right timing, this thing gets mixed up for a second and there is the series itself and a lot of people watched and watch the series itself and there was a lot of talk about it.
"I will tell you from the other side that there were also discussions about whether to make 'Nova', whether Yes would go for the film about it, when they would upload it and whether anyone would want to see this thing. In the end it became, as you know, the most watched docu-film in the history of Yes, Think how many years Yes has existed, the most watched in the history of Yes. So that means something, people came to see it and still see it and also came to see the massacre."
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"A lot of people watched and watched and there was a lot of talk about her."
"The cook"/screenshot, yes
Tel Aviv accidents
Both Bloody Murray and The Cook are both very Tel Aviv, urban series, which correspond with late bachelorhood.
Is this a business model?
"No, it's a coincidence, sorry, a total coincidence. I'm from Tel Aviv, of course. The owner of Castina, Amnon Rabbi, is also a Tel Avivian and I've been in Tel Aviv for many, many years."
This is actually the question, does the personal environment of both of you have an influence relationship.
"I don't know what causes why and in the end, you know, these are things that happen, it's not something intentional, but I don't think that by definition we only appeal to Tel Avivians. We also do the 'impersonators' and 'disclosure' and 'hanshi' which are not really Tel Avivim, but if that's the label, fine. First of all, we try to make good content, to which we connect as emotionally as possible. So in the worlds of drama, I'm very connected to the cook and Hanshi and Bloody Mori, but it's coincidence at the level of television."
I'll ask it another way.
You deserve Shalom Assig with the 1980s, you deserve Adir Miller with a traffic light, you deserve the creators of Sabri Marnan - is this something you run forward with?
"First of all, I would be very happy to promote each of them, of course, of course. I think that as a production company, any production company, at the end of the day your ambition and your goal is to do everything you do in the best way, in the most professional way and bring the best product you can bring. So, if I had the opportunity to do the 1980s, Ramzoor and Sabri - certainly I would want to do it.
"Maybe I can be less emotionally attached to certain things, but as a production house I want to do it.
Even on a business level, even on a general positioning level, I don't want to be a niche, I want to be broad and I think Castina is broad or expanding all the time, but of course I would love to do those series you mentioned."
"Just an excellent actress."
Rotem Sela/screenshot, yes
"Almost all the actresses in Israel auditioned for the role, I'm not exaggerating. In the end, the creators and we and the broadcaster decided to go with whoever we think is the most suitable. She doesn't have a 'Rotem Sela placement'"
Apropos a nod to the mainstream.
Rotem Sela plays more or less in all your series.
"Why? Only in 'The Cook' and 'Bloody Murray'."
I will ask directly: are you casting her because she is the best-known talent in Israel and it brings an audience?
Do you think she is a good actress?
"First of all, she is an amazing actress, truly, one of the best actresses in the country. In the end, as a production company, I have my opinion and it is decided many times, but it is not decisive. First of all, there is the creator of the series, and there is the broadcaster. No one will say 'I'll take Rotem Sela, just because she's Rotem Sela'. Absolutely not. The question is, is she a good actress and does she serve the role. It was like that in Massacre in the first season and it was like that in Bloody Murray of course. Both here and here, almost All the actresses in Israel auditioned for the role, I'm not exaggerating. In the end, the creators and we and the broadcaster decided to go with whoever we think is the most suitable. So that's just it, she doesn't have a Rotem Sela placement."
But the feeling, nevertheless, is that both she and Dana Frieder in the massacre at the end are playing themselves.
I don't say this as a disadvantage, but that it is part of the prerequisites for this position.
Both are really from Tel Aviv, both are very beautiful.
"I can say that in the end Rotem, both in Bloody and in the other series she does that are not ours, is simply an excellent actress. Really. And they wouldn't have hired her if she wasn't an excellent actress. And in the second season of The Cook, we were really looking for another new female character, and as mentioned , all of them, almost all of them did auditions and in the end it felt that Dana was the most suitable for the role. This one and I think it proved itself."
As far as you are able to say about yourself, how much do you give an opening to new creators versus veteran creators?
"You have to understand something before that. I come with proposals or series or anything else to the broadcasting bodies, and in the end the decision is up to the broadcasting body as to what it goes for or doesn't go for. I am very, very happy to hear new voices, and we are completely open to this matter. But in the end we check who can provide the goods, in every genre, not only in scripted and dramas, but also in docu. The offers are
from here
to really endless.
this.
So there is one page called a synopsis, and there are thousands of such excellent pages that I have read, but at the end of the transition from a synopsis to the thing itself, not many can do it.
Do you know how to write and turn it from a real offer to a series?
"If he hasn't done anything in his life, but it's still an amazing thing that I feel there's something to do with him, I can interest a broadcasting organization, and then we'll start working with him. We'll send him samples, accompany him, hold his hand a bit. We'll play ping pong and ask 'Come write'. Because in the end, if someone comes up with this series, he will have to write it. So let's see if he can write it.
"Now, we can give help, a friend to script editors, but in the end you have to come to the body transmission.
And if the broadcast body says interesting, then we start such, you know, some kind of cooperation.
And if he says it's not interesting, and I try other broadcasters and they say it's not interesting, I really have nothing to do with it, and sadly we have to say goodbye to this creator."
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"A very, very important part of Kastina."
The impersonators/screenshot, Keshet 12
Don't pretend to be trash
Basically, the one who finances the production costs is actually the future broadcasting body, and you are the middleman for that matter.
The middleman who also builds the shell.
"True, but there may be an intermediate stage where we say there is someone or something here that we believe in. We will invest a moment in the initial investment in a script editor, in the development of this thing, and we will come to the body of the broadcast when we are more prepared. Because by the way, this is something that has changed. You used to come With an excellent idea and an excellent creator, and the broadcaster would agree, he would give you development. Today, many times they say no, come after development. Or let's see if this creator knows how to write himself, and then the production company has to decide whether to finance the The development stage"
"impersonators" and "exposure".
I think it's trash.
And I do not say this to condemn them.
Do you share this thought of mine?
"Look, at the end of it in the general worlds of an investigative program. Take the big things that have been done in impersonation or exposé over the last few years. The big things were basically investigations into sexual predators. It was this thing or whoever was suspected of sexual offenses, so I don't think the word trash is Correct. These are investigative prime programs. As with everything, there is a matter of taste. Some people connect with it more or connect with it less."
Do you connect to the genre?
"Yes, I connect. I have to make sure that everything that comes out of Castina is at the highest level, in every way. If it's an investigative program, then the investigation will be tight. We're at Prime Keshet, so the product will be prime. That's what we do, that's our job. In the end, you You know, I don't want to say the cliché that everyone was my son and I love everyone, but yes, in the end I have to be whole and sign what comes out of Castina. And impersonators and exposure, that's a very, very important part of Castina."
"No, nothing to say. Failure."
Cast "Married Plus"/Splash
"Regarding the reform, let's all pray and hope that it will not pass. Just like many other things related to this government will not pass"
the television industry.
On the one hand it is shrinking, and on the other hand there is constant talk about booming and content and exports.
sort me out
"Look, there aren't many broadcasters here. Some of the broadcasters that have been added in recent years are not obligated to produce Israeli content, and on the other hand, they have taken a lot of subscribers and customers. Thus, the number of customers of mainly, say, Yes and Hot has been reduced. What they have to invest in content is a derivative of The amount of their subscribers.
"In addition, the foreign streaming giants have joined. Netflix, Apple, Amazon, all of which are also not committed to local content. So on the one hand, the number of subscribers decreases, and on the other hand, they are not obligated to make content for others, so we, the industry, are in a problem Opposite, there is a crazy creative force here, it hasn't changed, there are creators here, we talked about some of the things that are only ours. Think how many other things are being done in Israel. Amazing things. But little by little the places where they can express themselves are shrinking. And I think, terrible Very problematic."
And this is before the Karai reform, which if passed will produce even less regulation.
So how do you see the future?
are you optimistic
are you pessimistic
"I'm a little pessimistic. Regarding the reform, let's hope and pray and hope that it doesn't pass. Just like many other things related to this government won't pass. But there will have to be some kind of regulation on such bodies that are here and take money from Israeli engines. They will have to support the industry, the Israeli creativity. It can be solved, it happens in other parts of the world.
"I know it's hard in the United States too, it's hard in England.
There, too, budgets are shrinking.
But we are small.
Even before we are in such problems, the market is small, and in the United States at the end the market is huge.
When you log into Netflix, think how many series are uploaded every day.
Several scripted series are uploaded there.
In order not to do injustice, I will say, 80% of them, every Israeli series is much better than them.
Real, by far.
But we won't get there, because in the end we're small, because in the end Netflix has also changed their model to markets that the chances are increasingly low that we'll reach them, so we're in trouble."
So what's the next fantasy?
"To make direct content in advance for American entities and not for Israeli entities.
I mean both."
Are there already talks? Is there a dialogue?
"Yes.
We want to, I don't know if it will come true in the end, but we are working very hard for it to come true.
In the end, let's say "Tehran" and "Alice" were very big successes, Apple bought them.
It was during the corona virus.
it happened.
There is always a chance for another Fauda (sold abroad D.O.), but the chances are small."
It goes back to the most banal and most requested question, is there a formula for success?
"No, I don't have it. I don't think it exists either. There are so many variables and elements that need to come together for something to be successful. And also what success is, it can be a local success, a great success and abroad.
This is our job every day.
Come and understand for a second what can work, what can't work, what will succeed.
We have a success rate, I think it's okay, but it's a daily struggle.
Look, it's also on TV, we talked about ranges before, you can work for many, many years on something, and in the end it didn't... it didn't work out the way you wanted, and that, and that's a big heartache.
It's a pain, a lot of people are involved in the creation of anything.
Of course, the most drama, but also reality and docu.
In the end you work, you give it your all.
In the end it doesn't work.
In conclusion, give me your most glorious failure.
Come to him bravely.
"Look, let's put it this way, the biggest failure in the reviews was the Israeli adaptation we made of 'Married Plus'. Many, many episodes, big thoughts, great desire, enthusiasm. And in the end, failure. Nothing, nothing to say. Failure.
"It was very disappointing.
Think how many people worked on it.
The adaptation of the scripts, we then had discussions with abroad, there were people here who did the original series. And in the end it didn't work. That might also have been a lesson. I came from journalism, I edited a television newspaper, then I moved to television and realized that I had no idea about television, even though I preached To the whole world.
"We really try to succeed as much as possible and we also fail.
And there is one thing you know, you work hard on it and either you don't see it, or you get criticized and it sucks the most.
But really, you keep going.
As in football, I'm a Hapoel Tel Aviv fan."
More on the same topic:
Manny Aviram
Castina
rating
The cook - a series
Rotem Sela
Rainbow
Nova
War of Iron Swords
Bloody Murray
the pretenders