Avigdor Lieberman in an interview with Tal Shel on his weekend 04/18/24/Walla system
"We are not a step away from victory, but a step away from humiliation," said the chairman of Yisrael Beitenu Avigdor Lieberman in an interview for his weekend show at the Walla studio. Lieberman did not spare his criticism of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and the way the war was conducted. "This war cabinet should take responsibility and resign. We don't have a defense minister, but a threat minister," he said.
More than half a year into the war in Gaza. The north is deserted and desolate, on the other hand life has returned to normal on the seashore in Gaza. Is this what complete victory looks like?
"A step away from complete victory. The situation is really serious. Both the failure, and the conduct of the war today is, in diplomatic terms, very unsuccessful. As you mentioned, we have five open arenas - Hamas, Hezbollah, Syria and Iraq, the Houthis and the Iranians. What happened yesterday Lawlessness has spread in the north. Our soldiers and residents are like ducks on the range. There is no other word for it. Almost 200 days of war, why are the soldiers in the community center and not in the outpost? It takes six months to set up an outpost, and it is close to the border. Someone should be held accountable for not doing this. But all the management is Shlomial. I hope no more arena develops with the Turks with this flotilla. I hear such and such voices in Turkey, talking about accompanying the supply ships with warships. If there is such a flotilla - Israel must prevent it, one and all. We must prevent this at all costs and we must prepare for it properly and first of all use all the diplomatic levers. It just can't be. The situation inside Turkey is difficult, economically and socially, and perhaps it is convenient for them to escape from the internal problems right now with Israel in the Palestinian issue."
And now it's too late to respond?
"We react, they react. We will react, and they will react again. Where do we stop? Where is the final station? This is too much for this government. They are not capable. After 200 days, it is clear that every challenge is much greater than them in numbers. We had to react strongly during the Iranian attack Every day you move away from the context, from their attack, the window of opportunity closes. I talk to friends in Washington and in Europe - they spout the same brash words and arrogance. We don't have a security minister, we have a threat minister. He is constantly threatening. First respond. You can't constantly wave your fists in the air without doing. First do, then talk.
"The prime minister decided at the time to prevent targeted thwarting of the leaders of Hamas. At the beginning of the war, he decided at the last moment to prevent that tie-breaking operation against Hezbollah. And even when the United States was already going with us, with Trump, on Soleimani's head - there he escaped as well. I think it's a behavior pattern. This is a person who is constantly debating and tormenting. No determination, no decisiveness. Lots of talk and zero action. I don't know what his priorities are. In Gaza, the shawarma stalls in Rafah are working, people go to the sea, receive twice as much aid as before the war, all crossings are open. And again, at the beginning of the war, Rahab said - we will not allow humanitarian aid, etc. Now open everything."
What about the hostage deal?
"At the moment we have no levers of pressure (for the return of the kidnapped). What cards do we have? Sinwar has no interest in the deal. He understands that he got everything without giving anything. He understands that the pressure is mainly on us and not on him. And he understands that all those captives when they return will tell about unpleasant experiences , so he has no interest. At the beginning of the war, before we gave up all the levers - if you don't know how to withstand the pressure (of the Americans), there is no strategy - the next poll , all the calculations are in the near term, and that's how the war works. At the beginning of the war, it was possible to say - return the prisoners or there would be no humanitarian supplies."
Referring to the mediators between Israel and Hamas, Lieberman said: "Both the Qataris and the Egyptians buy the Hamas narrative more than the Israeli interest. First of all, we have to decide what to do - you can't just threaten all the time. Right now there is no escape and we must take control of both Rafah and the Philadelphia axis There is smuggling there, of course, but if you want to do show-off, just touch the edge neighborhoods, in the suburbs of Rafah, it won't do anything."
Following the tension, she harshly criticized Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu: "He is the one who cultivated Hamas all these years. He also explains in his book that while standing firm, when Bennett and I demanded to go to the end, he prevented it and he is proud of it. The two heads of the Shin Bet - Cohen and Argman - explain that each time he prevented the elimination of the senior officials. There were innumerable opportunities to eliminate the Niyya and all the heads of Hamas. Right now the one who bears the first responsibility is Netanyahu. I haven't spoken to him since 2019. They called me twice during War, they said we want to invite, then they called and said there was a meeting of the War Cabinet and it was already late. The next day it was the same. On the third, no one called. That's how everything goes there. The War Cabinet should take responsibility and resign If there are no results after 200 days, they should take responsibility and go home. The defense minister was also in office for 10 months, he was the commander of the Southern Command."
Should Gantz and Eisenkot also resign?
"I read that Eisenkot writes that there is a shuffle and no decisions are made for three months. After the document that was leaked to the media that he wrote, I don't understand what should remain. If we reach a situation where Gantz goes to Washington without informing the Prime Minister, and Netanyahu tells the ambassador not to attend the meetings, this whole game is child's play , this annoyance. You can talk about changing a government and overthrowing a government, but not when Gantz and Eisenkot give them legitimacy. This government is unable to cope. As soon as someone is unable to handle the task, someone else is needed. We changed the commander of the Southern Command during the Yom Kippur War, Churchill changed Chamberlain during the war. Instead of a step from victory, we are a step from humiliation."
Will the issue of conscription bring down the government?
Shas and Torah Judaism with Spakhtel will not be scraped from the government. When the Minister of the Interior talks about the fact that the ultra-Orthodox cannot have a diskette. After the elections, a Zionist coalition must be formed. A Zionist state creates an anti-Zionist majority. It cannot be that the ultra-orthodox and the few will not give their part - in military or civilian service. We established a government without ultra-Orthodox. Yes, it didn't last, but it did good for the Israeli economy. The Shas parties and Torah Judaism work against all the values of Judaism. The sources show us that Israel had warriors - Yehoshua ben Nun, the Maccabees, etc., a groom coming out of a room and a bride from her veil. We have seen all the Shas rabbis who find a more far-reaching document, not just yeshiva students They won't enlist, but all the ultra-Orthodox will."
On his relationship with Yosh Shas Aryeh Deri: "There was no warming between me and Deri. You want me to join the government, I would be happy to join the war cabinet. I had one 'secret' meeting with Deri in the Knesset plenum. I hope we will be able to establish something big and orderly , a real Jabotinsky right. I hope that I will succeed in uniting most of the forces. At the moment, we need to see how the course of the war is changed. There is no war, there are targeted operations."
On the unification of forces on the right: "I know Yossi Cohen, a man of many rights, with all the criticisms about him. Is he suitable for political leadership? I do not give grades. The more good people go into politics, the better the end result will be. There are currently many players who are warming up on the lines - including Naftali Bennett, including Ayelet Shaked, including the securityists, and I don't know who else will emerge. When we get to the elections, we will have to prepare a move as well. After the elections, we will demand a Zionist coalition."
What role would you like to return to in this era?
"First of all for the position of Prime Minister, of course. I see myself no less than others, but we don't divide the bear's skin before we are hunted. We need to get to the elections and then we'll talk. With this government, you can't win the war. Every Dardak understands that. A day's war Kippur took 19 days, after that we were on the road to Cairo and Damascus. This cannot continue with this government and this war cabinet."