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Bnei Zipper: "They attack Sarah Netanyahu for no reason, just as anti-Semites attack Jews" - Walla! culture


Yair Lapid ("He also says to himself, 'What fun that Netanyahu is in power'"), the left ("He is the one who is to blame for there being extremism on the right"), Sarah Netanyahu ("Everyone is lying about her") and Amos Oz ("It turns out he had a good forced daughter") : Just before the opening of the Metula Poets' Festival, Benny Zipper's director shoots everywhere. Interview

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Bnei Zipper: "Attacking Sarah Netanyahu for no reason, just as anti-Semites attack Jews"

Yair Lapid ("He also says to himself, 'What fun that Netanyahu is in power'"), the left ("He is the one who is to blame for there being extremism on the right"), Sarah Netanyahu ("Everyone is lying about her") and Amos Oz ("It turns out he had a good forced daughter") : Just before the opening of the Metula Poets' Festival, Benny Zipper's director shoots everywhere.



  • Benny Zipper

  • Sarah Netanyahu

  • Benjamin Netanyahu

  • Poetry Festival in Metula

  • Yitzhak Laor

  • Amos Oz

  • Eyal Golan

  • Country

  • Meir Wieseltir

Sagi Ben Nun

Friday, 14 May 2021, 00:00 Updated: 00:12

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Bnei Zipper (Photo: Courtesy of those photographed, Bnei Bachar)

"Benny Zipper is looking for provocations, and will say everything to get attention" - these words were said not by an enemy and not a stranger but a relative of the veteran literary editor. When I tell Zipper about the criticism from that relative he smiles: "Look, I admit and confess that I like attention, which is why I chose the profession I work in. For years I was a literary supplement editor, I was well known in the barn but not too much. The leap has happened since I More writing about current affairs and expressing my political views, has led me to discover this treasure of being the center of attention. It's fun. I do not apologize for it. I do not see it as bad. Of course it can be seen in the negative or positive, but I admit and confess - Yes, I want and am looking for attention. What's more I know I'm not 20 anymore, and one day it's over. One day I'll already be Alte Kaker and no one will remember I existed. Until then, I`m making the most of it ".

The question is how much provocation comes at the expense of telling the truth for you.

"Of course I will not say things I do not believe in. Look, I feel I have a role in this world. All the years I was in the literary barge and on the left I lived with people who are very confident in their righteousness. I mean, if you wake them up in the middle of the night they know what to say." "Wait. I always felt I could not stand this kind of people. I prefer to be with the wrong people rather than the people who constantly recite the right things to you. So my job is by provocation to try to make people doubt their absolute righteousness a little bit."

The interview with Zipper, editor of Haaretz's Culture and Literature section, is taking place ahead of the Metula Poets' Festival he is conducting (starting this year in collaboration with Shiri Lev Ari), which opens the next day (Sunday) is in question due to security escalation and riots. The phone call with him took place on Monday evening, and was interrupted in the middle by an alarm.

There is grave concern that Netanyahu, a defendant who heads a transitional government, is now setting the country on fire for political reasons - in order to prevent a change government, and to escape his trial.

"These things are always repeated. When people do not like someone they will find reasons underground to blame him. The exact same thing is said about the corona, that he invented the corona to get out of law and form a unity government. Politics is to take situations that exist, not you cause them. I think that in the case before us there is no doubt that the person who can do the best is. I am one hundred percent sure that in their hearts the people of the bloc of change are also older quietly that they themselves should not be responsible and that there is a responsible adult - Netanyahu. "What fun that Netanyahu is in power now and the responsibility is on him. He is just a very considerate person."

More on Walla!

Missiles in the air, riots in the streets, and pyromaniacs in the studio enjoy every moment

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Bnei Zipper and Prime Minister Sarah Netanyahu's wife (Photo: courtesy of those photographed)

Let me disagree with you.

Netanyahu could have put out the flames and he did not, among other things when his Kahanist partners were allowed to pour fuel into the fire.

Ben Gvir told Bibi, according to reports, that war would prevent a change government.

Some believe that this is a "Netanyahu peace war."

"This is a rumor that is circulating in March that he seems to be encouraging the extremists to pour oil on the fire. There is no one more than Netanyahu who is trying as much as possible to put out the flames. He said there are police and we ask people not to take the law into their own hands, and it refers to the extremist groups and incendiary groups." ".

Netanyahu is the one who warmly embraced Ben Gvir the priest and the pyromaniac, signed a surplus agreement with him, urged his constituents to elect him, put him in the Knesset, and did not prevent the fire he lit.

"It is a fact that Netanyahu once made a coalition with Ganz. I tell you from personal and intimate acquaintance, there is nothing he dislikes more than violent radical extremism. Ben Gvir is not a creation of Netanyahu's. Ben Gvir, according to my analysis, is a phenomenon that exists because An extreme Israeli left that has moved so far away from the center. What once became the sane left has become very extreme, you no longer have a left that is not extreme, and then what happens is that naturally and considerably extremism is created from the right. And listen, you see many people who love Netanyahu but very "We are disappointed with him because he is not extremist enough, and these are the people who went to Ben Gvir. The left is to blame for there being extremism on the right."

The man and bow tie Benny Zipper was born 68 years ago in Tel Aviv, the son of an electrical engineer and a doctor who immigrated from Turkey. He holds a bachelor's degree in French literature from the Department of French Culture at Tel Aviv University. He has been working in Haaretz since 1978, and since 1989 has been the editor of the newspaper's literary supplement. For the past five years he has been the artistic director of the Metula Poets' Festival. In addition, he wrote and translated books from French, in which he dealt with, among other things, the culture of immigrants from Turkey and homosexuality in modern Israel. Zipper is married and a father of three.

Over the years, a number of allegations have been made against him regarding treatment of women.

Thus, for example, five years ago, the author of these lines revealed in Walla that the writer Galit Dahan-Carlebach had sent Zipper for over a decade over 20 texts for a literary and cultural supplement in Haaretz, edited by him, and claimed that he rejected all her requests.

Until she decided to send him her song with a fake name of a man, and for the first time she was answered in the affirmative and the song was published.

"Galit Dahan Carlebach did indeed do this exercise," Zipper now says.

"I published her song that she sent under the fictitious name of a man, but she wrote the song in a completely different style. It was a prose song, very intriguing, so I published it. She really made me a 'therapy market.' I got that market because of her. I admit it. "I confess that I was wrong. I had to correct my ways."

More on Walla!

Benny Zipper rejected dozens of works by a writer, until she sent him a fake name of a man

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Bnei Zipper (Photo: Reuven Castro)

And more on the matter concerning the treatment of women. Following the Eyal Golan affair, you wrote a column in Haaretz in which you justified the sexual exploitation of young fans by artists. Following this, hundreds of male and female poets announced that they would not be attending the Metula Festival as long as you were the artistic director, set up an alternative festival and an online literature supplement. It should be noted that later apologized and wrote "shocked by myself, stop writing." How do you look at this storm in the perspective of time?

"It kind of reminds me of what Torch said this month - 'Each of us carries after him five quotes he regrets.' When Torch said that, all of a sudden it dressed up exactly as I said on this subject. In real time, when the whole story exploded, Yaron London called me "And he said he understood that it was a mouthful, and then he told me the same thing, that we all carry something like that behind us. And there is no choice, because we are in the media, talking or writing, so we get something like that from time to time."

Yaron London understands something about this.The amount of his embarrassing statements is inconceivable.

"I learned a lesson from that - read twice before sending articles to print, and think twice about what you write due to the sensitivities that exist today. Even when you want to express some interesting and original opinion sometimes you have to think twice. Don't be right, be smart."

In late March, Lilach Wallach published an investigation on the "Hottest Place in Hell" website that brought testimonies from dozens of women who claimed that Yitzhak Orr harassed and sexually assaulted them, including an allegation of violent rape in his home. Following the investigation, Haaretz publisher Amos Schocken announced that he would not give Laor another stage for his articles in his newspaper. Many felt that Schocken's move was welcome but was done very late, as testimonies about him had been published years earlier.

"In light of this it is a difficult story. I personally think that the separation between man and his work should be made. You cannot undo the work of man. On the other hand, the right of a newspaper editor to say - not in our school. I do not need these troubles. It is. Not that Amos Schocken deleted all his works. He said I can no longer. I understand those who were hurt. I understand Schocken's consideration. He needs to run a newspaper, and there are people who are hurt. What has changed is the public atmosphere, things that were once tolerable are not tolerated Today. Over the years I knew that light is not perfect. At the time it was all about the atmosphere in the press, and especially at the night desk, it was very wild. The night editors were all kinds of guys who would come nervous and talk rudely. Rudeness was part of the job, I witnessed light speaking rudely to people "But it was normative rudeness. I did not witness the harassment. I admit that I often wanted to invite Laor to the Metula Festival, and always when I tried the committee stood on its hind legs."

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Benjamin Netanyahu (Photo: Reuven Castro)

And what do you think about the storm that erupted after Amos Oz's daughter claimed in her book she published in February that her father had beaten, cursed and humiliated her?

"Amos Oz was in the eyes of a normative person and a great writer, and he is still in the eyes of most of the public a great writer and a great person. I did not agree with his political views but he was a respectable and great writer. Galia Oz's book did not affect Amos Oz's character in the public eye. "It is not like cases like Yitzhak Laor, Moshe Ivgi and Yehuda Meshi Zahav. Someone tried to challenge his character. It did not work. People understood that in addition to all his troubles, he also had a good forced daughter."

You are a big supporter of Oriental poetry.

What led to the decline of the Arspoatica group, after its resounding leap into consciousness about 8 years ago, and even though it was a new, interesting and very well-publicized wave of Oriental poetry?

"What happened with Arspoatica is like everything that happens with an avant-garde movement with a revolutionary and innovative message. The establishment will always make sure to swallow it and dissolve it. That's what happened. We gave Shlomi Hatucha and Roi Hassan a radio program, Roi was invited to teach at the university. , Why would they say no? Naturally, once you have such a revolutionary message, once you do not live this revolution, then this message loses its authenticity. So slowly they became established. That is, today Roi Hassan's poetry is still good but no longer "In it the knife between the teeth as it was before. And the same with Shlomi Hatucha, he is less than institutional but he lost that sharpness that was in the beginning. That way it gives way to a new wave that will be a few more years, who knows what will happen."

The Metula Poets' Festival will begin on Sunday (May 16) and last for three days.

Bnei Zipper is joined this year by songs by Lev Ari in the management of the festival, whose title this year is "One Quiet Moment Please", just as Natan Zach's song in his memory will be dedicated to the opening event.

In addition, the festival will include meetings with brides and grooms of the Israel Prize for Literature and Poetry, a re-examination of the work of Bialik, Yona Wallach, Avot Yeshurun ​​and Brenner, contemporary poetry in the Arab space, tributes to Nurit Zarchi and Hedva Harkabi and more, an interview with media man Kobi Meidan.

The festival is one of the flagship projects of the Confederation House under the management of Effie Banya.

Admission to the festival events is free, with pre-registration and in accordance with the Green Label guidelines.

More details here.

"A good forced daughter."

Amos and Galia Oz (Photo: screenshot, Reuven Castro + News 12)

The poet and Israel Prize winner Meir Wieseltir dramatically announced his retirement from his planned participation in the Poets' Festival, saying that "cooperation with Bnei Zipper is detrimental to health and art. The Papillon man cannot operate in the field of literature without sticks and tricks."

"I have a long relationship with Meir Wieseltir, which begins with my election as editor of Haaretz's literary supplement in 1989. Wieseltir subsequently wrote that he had to demonstrate in front of the front pages of Haaretz to fire Bnei Zipper. I did not understand, what did I do to you? What do you want from me? Since I did not get into quarrels, I always turned to him, he published songs with me, recently even published a cycle of songs, stories, and once gave his correspondence with Yair Horowitz and Yona Wallach. I realized that it should not be too annoying, so I've always been very matter-of-fact. Now that Shiri Lev Ari has entered the management of this year's festival with me, she said, 'Let's bring in Wieseltier.' I told her 'Do it,If I do that, he'll make it tzimes. '

"He said he wanted to attend the opening ceremony to read songs there - we said okay, he wanted a separate panel - I invited Prof. Ariel Hirschfeld to speak in praise of his poetry, everything was already organized. And suddenly, hop, as I expected it to happen he canceled. That's his way. He hung up. It's in my 'sticks and tricks', but there was no 'sticks and tricks' in this case. I did nothing. He might have expected me to call him, but I did not do it so as not to get into confrontations with him. What can I do? When he agreed I told Shiri it's too good to be true, I'm already waiting for the moment he's canceling. It's a little annoying to me that he's canceled because of her, she's her first year running the festival and will probably also be my heiress later, "Do you have a responsibility to the audience that comes as far as Metula to hear you, rents rooms, and after it appears on the show you cancel ?!".

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Regrets the column.

Eyal Golan (Photo: Nir Pekin)

Why did you actually need another artistic director by your side?

What is the contribution of Shiri?

"I always say and also say about myself that I am like Bibi of literature, in the sense that I seem to hold a position and not move from it. I have been editing the literary supplement since 1989. When I entered the Metula Festival I was supposed to serve for two years and this is the fifth year. The Metula Festival is a public festival. In recent years there was an art committee that had women who balanced me. Because everything was terribly reduced because of the situation, the same role is played by Aryan heart songs. She is both a woman and sensitive to women. In addition, by her role in literature and radio and culture. "She knows poets who often elude me. She is more involved in the new poets scene."

At the closing event of the Poets' Festival, a "spring" award will be presented for a lifetime achievement for the poet and translator Aharon Shabtai.

"We waited anxiously to see if Aharon Shabtai would receive the Israel Prize, and after it became clear on Independence Day that he did not receive it, we decided to give him the prize with us. I had a feeling, from deep acquaintance with the system, that he would not receive the Israel Prize. Make up for all the years of not giving awards to women. And not wanting to give an award to someone who wrote pornographic poetry. So we decided to give him a Lifetime Achievement Award before it's too late. Always give the awards in poetry and literature too late, when people can no longer enjoy it at all. "Awards for people when they are at their peak, give them to people when they are already at their end. The most tragic and ridiculous case was Avot Yeshurun, who was already on his deathbed when he received the Israel Award."

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"You have a responsibility to the audience."

Meir Wieseltir (Photo: Courtesy of the family, Zohar Feldman)

This year's festival will hold elections for the title of Israel's National Poet.

Which is reminiscent of the fact that three years ago, at the Poets' Festival, they held elections for the title of national poet, which Roni Somek won, which angered the very choice of a national poet.

Won't you absorb criticism this time too?

Is there really a need for a title like the National Poet?

"After Ronny Somek was elected, he said he did not want to be the national poet but the favorite poet. That was the festival's gimmick back then. I did not do it for nothing. In reformed countries like the United States and England there is such a thing as 'Poet laureate', a kind of National poet or poet of poetry. The role of the national poet is to give direction and feel that there are hierarchies in the world of literature even in the postmodern world where there are no hierarchies. And he is the beloved poet and model, not only because of what he wrote but also because he is a positive figure. "Let us become the 'national poet' this time, and in this way we will catch two birds with one stone - both women, women, the center and a national poet will be chosen."

Did you try to interest the Netanyahu couple to come and read songs at the festival?

"The truth is that I really wanted to do a panel on poetry by poets from the Land of Israel who were somehow pushed out, poets who sat in kibbutzim, moshavim, Galilee and Negev and did not get exposed because they were modest people, including Sarah Netanyahu's father, who was a really good poet. He sang and the letters he wrote. He would write all kinds of letters to professors and ask 'Am I really a poet or not.' At one point I said let's do such a panel. I then brought up the idea to Sarah, and she said okay, but in advance she suspected it would not happen, She told me, 'Do not deceive yourself, there will be such a scandal.' Then, what do you think was the reaction of people who were on the artistic committee? 'No, people will boycott it, people will not come if Sarah comes.' Maybe rightly and maybe the audience would really get upset "If Sarah had come to read her father's songs. Even though I heard her read her father's songs in a wonderful way. Maybe one day this panel will happen. By the way, Netanyahu's father also wrote songs in his youth."

The prime minister is said to be a "book man."

But does he read anything other than biographies?

"Bibi is a man who reads a lot. He reads less prose and poetry, but he is very sensitive to poetry. On one occasion I read him a poem by the modern Greek poet Kwafis, the Bialik of Greece, and he said to me 'Wow, my son, what a poem. Where did you find it? "I told him, what do you mean where I found it, that's my profession. He's very enthusiastic, and as if he understood him very deeply. Look, he's a cultured man in a way that is hard to compete with. .

Bnei Zipper (Photo: Courtesy of the photographed)

Yaakov Kadosh, who served for years as the director of the company that was responsible for cleaning the prime minister's residence, is suing the prime minister's office for NIS 300,000, claiming that he was forced to take part in corrupt conduct at the prime minister's residence. He claims that Sarah Netanyahu severely abused the facts of the daycare center, acted racistly towards the facts, drank 2-3 bottles of wine a day and was attacked in a maddening manner towards the facts. After that and many more negative testimonies about Sarah, how are you able to admire her?

"Everything is a lie and a lie. The beginning of my acquaintance with Sarah Netanyahu was that I believed these stories, and I really went to check things out with my own eyes. Then the connection was made. I can explain it. I call this phenomenon Sarah Phobia. Treat her, stick her nails in her. Then I'll tell you all the things. I'll tell you why I'm so attached to it. Because all my childhood until high school I went through the exact same process that Sarah Netanyahu went through. You did nothing and for some reason you did not come good to anyone and become his victim. Treat all the evil in the world for you. "

Your claim that she did nothing is outrageous. Over the years, many other allegations have been made about Sarah's treatment of domestic workers and the prime minister's residence. In addition, in the police testimony of the former Netanyahu couple's adviser, the late Shaya Segal, he claimed that "Sarah is demanding, crazy who shouts and screams." So in your opinion, so many people are lying?

"Yes. Everyone is lying. Once they recognize that someone's blood is no man's land, they will attack straight away. Humans are like animals and have a herd instinct. Of course no one is perfect. It's a bit like anti-Semitism. After all, Jews are not perfect. There are Jews with "Long nose, Jews with short noses, Jews with or without a platform. And what is anti-Semitism? That you attack a person and look for him in all the shortcomings that can only be found, and then you say - here, you see, he deserves to be killed."

Do you really compare the criticism of Sarah to anti-Semitism?

"That's exactly it. So many generations say of the Jews that they are thieves, dishonest and ugly, so there are those who think there is no smoke without fire, and there is probably something in it. It is exactly the same argument. There are great friends of Sarah Netanyahu, lots of bureau workers, who adore This woman who is so nice and good with them, but they do not go to the media. "

Zipper later adds: "But again I emphasize that I think Sarah has been abused for years for no reason as Jews are abused just because they are Jews - not because I seek attention but because I believe it is true."

One day, when the Netanyahu era is over, what will someone like you, who is considered "improved" do?

"First of all, I do not believe that the Netanyahu era is over. And let's say the Netanyahu era ends as prime minister, su? I will still think he is a great person and I will continue to look at him as a role model. I will be sorry if he is not prime minister, then I will write that I am sorry he is "Not a prime minister. But he will still be an exemplary figure in my eyes. I do not admire him just because he is in power."

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Source: walla

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