Jean-Marie Le Pen's shadow hovers over the French presidential election, though the elderly politician tries to keep a very low profile so as not to hurt his young daughter Marin's chances of making history and being the first woman and nationalist representative to take over the keys to the Elysee Palace.
Marin Le Pen does everything to convince her that she is very different from her father.
An opponent, incumbent President Emanuel Macron, is doing everything he can to tie Le Pen to her father and incriminate her as a representative of the "far right."
For decades, her father, who will turn 94 this June, is considered the "bad boy" of French politics.
His statements, which stated that the Holocaust was only a "small detail" of World War II, labeled him an extremist, anti-Semitic and racist right-winger.
The founder of the "National Front" has been prosecuted many times and accused, among other things, of inciting racism, hatred and defending Nazi war crimes.
He himself claimed to be politically persecuted by the legal system.
So there was a great deal of astonishment when, exactly 20 years ago, he managed to qualify for the second round of the presidential election in front of the then incumbent president, Jacques Chirac.
Although all rival political forces, right and left, rallied against him, Penn managed to get about 18% of the vote.
Marin, who enlisted in her father's campaign in those days, has since tried her best to get rid of the extreme right-wing image that has stuck to her family name and party.
In 2015, after reducing the importance of the Holocaust again, Marin decided to keep him away from the party he founded in 1972.
After years of legal battle, the expulsion took effect, but Le Pen Sr. remained the party's honorary president until his retirement three years ago from politics.
Near his retirement he published two volumes of his voluminous memoirs, which describe in detail his rich six-decade-old political career.
He vehemently opposed his daughter's decision to change the name from the "National Front" to the "National Convention."
At the start of the current presidential election, he expressed support for Marin's rival in the nationalist right-wing camp, Arik Zamor, but recently reconciled with his daughter and returned to support her.
Even the repeated tensions between the father and his daughter do not prevent him from acknowledging that she knew how to turn his party from a marginal political current into a significant force, and twice in a row to qualify for the second round of the presidential election.
We met at the family villa in the suburb of Roy-Malamzon in western Paris.
I was the first Israeli journalist to interview him in 1988 when he was a Member of the European Parliament.
Despite his advanced age, Le Pen continues to be active and travels daily to his office, and his mind is clear.
"Given my age, I have no reason to complain. I feel good," he says.
"Do you appreciate that Marin has any real chance of becoming president?" I ask.
"I hope, still, that she wins the presidential election," he replies, "I can not contribute much beyond giving my vote for her. That's all I can give her now. She has run her campaign at a fairly high level, in my opinion. Her opponent is the president, "Beside him stands the whole array of the state. This array can, admittedly, sometimes be an obstacle. We'll see what happens. Surely the president has more means to ensure his re-election. Now, it's the people's choice."
Macron treats Marin as your heiress, to emphasize the connection between you and thus give her a certain label.
Is for you Marin the continuity of your activity or something else entirely?
"This is female continuity and as a result it is more moderate in its statements and behavior. However, the political situation is not similar to the one in which I acted. She's done well and she's done well. I know this route. I've done it several times, and it's not very easy when you're in opposition
.
Do you agree with that?
"I do not think so. Eric - I like him very much, he has a lot of advantages and he did a very nice campaign himself, maybe disappointed with the result he got, because he snatched some pretty cruel truths from a country that is very careful, and I will avoid using a more negative word."
Marin read in a video she posted on the eve of the confrontation with Macron for voters not to believe those who say she and her party are far-right.
This cloud of accusation hovers over it.
"This is the main argument of the opponents. They say it is extreme right. What is the meaning of the term 'extreme right'? There is the word extreme, which is never used in reference to the left. The first presidential election) does not say it is extreme left. Even the Communists are not said to be extreme left. The word extreme is reserved only for the right. And the term "extreme right" seems to hide some magic. And the socialist of the right, in my opinion, represents Marin. "
Jean-Marie Le Pen and daughter Marin, Photo: Reuters
The conservative French right has almost completely disappeared in this election.
"Not only he, but also the Socialist Party. The classical parties were swept away by the spirit of history.
What were they replaced with?
Personalities came in place of political labels.
And so, we have a struggle between Macron and La Pen.
Politics is inherent in the people and there is no longer a need for plans and political platforms. "
When you look at today's France, are you worried?
" Yes, I am worried about France and Europe.
Because of the demographic crisis.
Few people are aware of the fact that in the last fifty years there has been an ongoing demographic revolution.
The world population grew during this period from two billion people to eight billion.
This, without the gross resources increasing significantly.
That is, the amount of resources that can be allocated is dwindling.
"As this development continues to grow, we must expect global population growth and increasing difficulties at the national, European and international levels in dealing with this population explosion."
When you see Marin's relative success compared to you do you regret certain things you did or said?
"I have no regrets. I always did my best. For better or worse I defended ideas that were not always fashionable especially in the eyes of the administration that served. All my life I was in opposition, I fought faithfully and courageously. I apologize for giving myself compliments, but I think it's true "I struggled to defend the ideas that were in my right eyes and that I think experience has proven me right."
How did we get to the point where a Jewish presidential candidate is calling to vote for someone named La Pen?
Thirty years ago such a thing would have been unthinkable.
"Why not? I carry with me a reputation for being anti-Semitic, which my political opponents invented for me. I challenge them to find one of my political statements that is anti-Semitic. Just because I am right-wing and national have accused me of being anti-Semitic. That is not true at all. .
How, however, do you explain the fact that a Jew expresses identical positions to yours, which were considered extremist?
What happened in France?
Is it because of Islamic violence?
"This is not surprising. At the National Assembly there were Jewish deputies who belonged to the right and even the far right. There is certainly an antisemitic phenomenon that should have occupied Jewish organizations instead of persecuting the right and this is the Islamist danger, which exists among large popular masses and represents aggressive action. This is not the case. That those Jewish organizations tend to condemn automatically. "
Do you think, if Marin does not win this time, she will run again in five years or retire?
"I do not know. Who can say where we will be in another five years. I think the current conditions are quite dangerous. "Mediocrity, the weakness, that if it continues for a long time, it will lead to our disappearance."
Marin Le Pen on an election tour, Photo: AFP
How do you rate the other National Right parties in Europe, Austria, Italy, Germany?
"It is normal for the national political current to achieve. It does not surprise me. It is part of the natural reflexes of the peoples. The program of these parties varies from country to country. But there is nothing terrible about it. They do not support dictatorship or persecution of anyone. They are neither racist nor extremist Philosophical, political or economic.The struggle waged against us was in fact waged against fantasies that are probably inferior to the historical past of Europe.I have been in politics for over sixty years.I think if there was any justification for hostility against me on the part of certain circles, I would have long since disappeared. "And there have always been several million French people who supported these ideas. They did not want dictatorship, anti-Semitism or other things that were never included in my platform, my speeches or my private life."
What is the secret of the survival of the National Front, today the National Assembly, compared to other disappeared populist right-wing parties?
"(La Pen laughs) You can refer the question to rhinos, which have been plucking for so long. They have thick skin. They hold up well against attacks. And in retrospect my opponents secretly share my views, but they dare not say so."
Are you personally hurt that your daughter kept you away from the party?
"I can not say that it made me happy, being the party's founder and leader for 40 years who was ousted by a small destructive group of few people. However, I'll tell you a secret: it did not deprive me of sleep. It was unimportant to me and not a move that reflected any reality. In the eyes of some people, I was a distraction. They estimated that my position for 60 years reflected a certain rigidity. In my view, rigidity is the virtue of marble. In all honesty, now at the end of my life, I have no regrets. I had to present my candidacy then. I was the one who organized the whole campaign, I arranged everything. But I thought then I was too young. Here's another example of how things change. "In my political life. Still, that has not stopped the world from continuing to revolve around its axis."
Of all your political rivals, almost all of whom are no more, who do you value the most?
"It's not hard to say: Charles de Gaulle. It has to do with his historical trajectory. Without World War I, Colonel de Gaulle would have ended his life with a military pension in his home. The war allowed him to take a position that grew stronger over time, and events eliminated potential competitors for him."
Do you follow the beam in the Middle East, in Israel?
"Of course, with sympathy for the small people who fought for their survival and existence, who managed to seize power on the land of their ancestors. I always had a friendlier attitude towards him than an opposite tendency. I fought alongside Israeli soldiers in the Sinai War in 1956. I was among the French paratroopers parachuted in the Suez Canal. Behind us and seize Sinai. "
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